Before reading this article I highly suggest reading the first part. The past 72 hours has seen huge changes in the command structure of INFAMOUS and a PR campaign to assure members and allies all is well. To dive straight to the bottom of this I reached out to Benju, now the leader of INFAMOUS, directly to get his side of the story. Below is a transcript of our conversation minus a few off record comments.
Editors note – this transcript has not been edit from the original other than some minor formatting for readability purposes.
Sunbeam Diesel > o/
Benju > mails are going, my alliance has finally calmed its shit. People are feeling pretty good
Sunbeam Diesel > good to hear. Well if you have a few I have some questions I would like to ask so I can edit in a clear point of view on the topic from your perspective
Benju > absolutely
Sunbeam Diesel > In your opinion what were the primary factors which lead to the coup?
Benju > Lack of faith in Gree’s leadership and Plummeting morale
Sunbeam Diesel > I see many corporations are still in the alliance currently. Will you be allowing players caught up in the situation time to evac under friendly terms if they choose?
Benju > absolutely, of the 4 corps kicked, all of them have standings to evacuate their assets for as long as they need it, likely a week. 2 of them were alternate corps, so only 2 “real” corps kicked at this time, black aces (who left after the coup) and hell on earth
Sunbeam Diesel > With new leadership now in place where do you see INFAMOUS headed in the coming months?
Benju > honestly, the short to mid term is rebuilding us and redefining ourselves as an alliance outside of stainwagon. We will continue to fight for fun and for small objective with the querious fight club, and roam our neutral neighbours for content. Catch is an active region, one of the most active in the game and that is likely only going to increase with goons in delve, we won’t need to try hard to find something to do 🙂 What I did I honestly did for the line members of this alliance. The problems that we had were with Gree and hellpheonix, not the line members of either corporation.
Sunbeam Diesel > Understandable
Benju > Both corporations were also paid out their fair share of alliance isk based on their lifetime participation with INFAMOUS. % of total stratop attendance of all corps still in infamous * isk at time of coup = payout. The other development since your story was their petty revenge.
Sunbeam Diesel > Some corporations painted J3B as backstabbing Stainwagon, when in fact ties with the long held alliance were already strained. DO you feel this view as being justified?
Benju > J3B as a corporation was not the driving force of this coup. I had been leading this alliance for months while Gree and Aranin were both afk (with Gree only recently returning.) They can blame me directly if they want but Kelnon had little do with it. Beyond all of the CEO’s I worked with to get the vote flipped, I had the support of those corporations, not Kelnon. INGLORIOUS exec had several directors in it, but the CEO was held by Aranin. The alliance was still intact when my director roles were removed last night which could only have been done by Aranin. I had sent a mail to the partner alliance to have that exec flipped to a corp I did control. Clearly they did not do so in time, as when i awoke this morning, more than 3000 partners who had nothing to do with the coup were locked out of their assets and without an alliance.
Benju > I have made a new alliance already, and at this time more than half of those partners have already applied to it, and business will continue as normal
Sunbeam Diesel > good to hear
Benju > but my morning was spent frantically giving blue to 40+ corps so they could dock again
Sunbeam Diesel > Given the recent shakeup in Catch has there been any hint of enemy alliances engaging in sov war for the region or do you believe things will continue to stabilise?
Benju > Stainwagon has chosen to not take an option that would have ended the war losing them only tenerifis, but has committed to NIP GLORY and let us out of this war after a short period of blue standings to get assets out of each others stations.
Sunbeam Diesel > Okay they pretty much sums up the questions I had to clear things up and I appreciate you taking the time out of a busy day to answer them. Well thanks again and I wish you and your alliance the best in the coming months
Benju > thank you very much
Other developments with INFAMOUS include a massive change to doctrines and how they will moving forward with military efforts. Also a complete restructure to the alliance with members appointed to various roles and a glimpse into the future. A series of EvE mails pulled from EvE Skunk detailed as much and have been provided below to provide additional context to the story.
Hey guys,
So at this point everyone knows what has happened. This is going to be a pretty long mail, and I’m sure will be on reddit before I’ve even managed to press send.
What Happened
– As of Yesterday, July 31, I seized control of Infamous
– We are no longer as an alliance at war with Vanguard/DRF/FCON. Waffles contract stays with infamous to protect us in the short term.
– We will be leaving stainwagon, hopefully on good terms. I am still in discussions with Raven
– I have kicked the corp HellonEarth, as i can not work with their CEO. Their corp has blue standings to move out.
– Upon finding out, Gree/Aranin used their control of inglorious exec to kick the partner corporations. This was an act of pettiness that only caused me some extra work, but a lot of problems for our more than 3000 partners who had nothing to do with what happened. Because of this, the eve news articles and, i am removing them from alliance as well, as it is clear they do not want to leave on good terms. I will give them blue to continue to move their stuff out safely as I do not blame nor want to punish the line members.Why did this happen?
Leadership of this alliance has failed you lately. Not just through this war but for a while before it. But the pressures of this war brought it all to light pretty hard. Engagement from the top down has been horrible.
We all know Gree is hotheaded, but with Aranin gone dealing with real life, his leadership style has been the beatings will continue until morale improves. He also was not listening to High Command. Every other member of High Command had wanted hellphoenix out, for months. It had not been a secret in HC, but Gree kept him in there despite none of us wanting to work with him. He honestly believed at one point that his corporation with 8% of fleet participation (at the time) deserved 25% of alliance moon income. These arguments would devolve into namecalling and slander. The rest of us don’t always agree with each other, but when we have a discussion it’s productive and we can get somewhere without open insults. We simply couldn’t do that with Hell. We also have had Hell leak things out of our high command chats. This has gotten back to me from more than one source. Gree’s unwillingness to work with HC on this lead to HC turning into a dead chat. And a compelete lack of faith in how leadership was structured.
That brings us to the war. This war has been a shit show.
-It started with a friend (FEC) of a renter (Raumwaffen, now a full member of sw) attacking stella nova (a member of vanguard) space in Detorid.
-Vanguard started attacking to take their space back, as well as hitting FCON. SW geared up to go “defend” FEC and FEC retreated to raumwaffen space in Immensea.
– The war begins, neither side reaches out to discuss what happened or why, both are fully happy to go to war. Noone is the victim or innocentThis war has gone badly for us. In RUStz we were outnumbered more often than not unless we called a lot of batphones, Waffles was hired to support us, and frequently formed more with 1 corporation than most alliances in StainWagon. We were still outnumbered and that was turning into calling GOON batphones, earning SW a lot of resentment from alliances that might otherwise have liked us.
In ustz, we failed ourselves. Infamous lack of proper military leadership caused us to lose way more fights than we should have. We started stabilizing with the later help of Deveron and Jatinegara, and the help of Waffles. But with our timers set in really late USTZ/AUSTZ, we had some timers come out in AUS. This caused us to lose an important Ihub in the GXK constellation, causing us to lose cyno jammer and all tactical superiority holding that constelation. SW did not even try to form to support our timer, despite how much we had lost supporting them.
Raven is a great person and great FC, but he was the only FC the coalition had that had that could run fleets, which meant capitals and other resources were under utilized. If you did not speak russian, you could be nothing but an F1 monkey in a line ship or logi. This hurt us a lot.
Leadership, as it was, was unable and unwilling to address most of these problems.
What i have done, I have done not to protect some space pixels. If people had been having FUN losing this war, we’d have rode the train all the way to stain. But it seemed to me that noone was having fun. All of these problems combined to make a miserable experience for our pilots. People were actively avoiding logging in, not just for fleets but for anything. I did this because most of our core corps were seeing how unhappy their pilots were and several corporations were one foot out the door.
One way or another this war was ending for infamous, and I chose the best route I could to keep us whole.
Next mail will be, The Promised Plan, because I do have one.
This is the second eve-mail pulled from EvE Skunk sent by Benju on 8/2/2016
So, I told you why we did it, now to tell you how to fix it and where we go from here.
So First, a Restructure.
When Infamous first formed, we made a mistake of leaving things semi-democratic. This is no longer the case.
This is now a Benju-Tocracy,
There are no votes, there is no republic. All decisions fall at my feet, and I hold all responsibility. Since I had been our main diplo for the last year nearly all of our non-sw relationships are through me, and I will keep taking this role.
I however can obviously not RUN everything else myself, and I am not so egotistical as to think I know best about everything every time.
To that end I will have a council to advise me on different points and to bounce ideas off as a sanity check.
MrBluto/Seronea: Partner Management
The last while MrBluto has stepped up heavily helping with partner management, and the last several months of its success is thanks to him. There will be no changes to the operation or structure of the partner program other than the new alliance, however he will likely need to get some help managing it as the partner program has grown quite a bit and we don’t have enough people handling all the ihub upgrades and standings etc. If you want to help, he should be either reaching out or indicating the best way to get in touch with him. (requires 1-2 alts for accepting corps into partner alliance and slotting ihub upgrades into infamous ihubs)
Sero comes as part of the offer, and I’m glad to work with her. She always provides real feedback and doesn’t hold back. I can depend on her to ask the hard questions I need to make sure i have answers to before I commit to anything big.
Deveron: Military
Not having a single point of direction on the military level has held us back a bit. Deveron will fill this role, and help bring up other FC’s and streamline our doctrines a bit. Expect a mail from him in a bit on his plan. Anyone looking to FC can get in touch with him. Expect to start with small risk roams with t1 cruisers/dessies etc. (requires: ability to herd cats, and take constructive criticism. Ego smaller than small moon appreciated, but not required if backed with excellence)
Asmo: Flex/Spreadsheet
I’ve worked with Asmo for a long time, he’s a great unbiased opinion, and has a strange love-affair with spreadsheets. If i need stuff spreadsheeted he’s my man. He typically helps handle moon distribution as everyone agrees he is unbiased. Does not currently require help. (If he did, would require some fetish with excel)
Foobar Raboof: IT
Do I Need to talk about it? Foobar has expertly handled our IT services ever since we got off of -A- teamspeak. He does an excellent job and has accommodated all our needs through our growth. I don’t -think- he needs help with anything specific at the moment, but if he does he will reach out. (Requires Computer Wizardry Trained to 5 and Advanced Network Wizardy to 4)
Kelnon: Finances
He will not have access to the wallets directly, but he’s got a head for numbers and making wallets grow. Useful for bouncing ideas off of and making sure things are long term sustainable. (Does not need a team, unless you are literally made of money, need not apply)
Every CEO/DIR in the alliance: Everything non-opsec that relates to whole alliance
In the past CEO/DIR chats were barely utilized and the corps left out of the decision making. This is ass backwards as the alliance exists to serve the corps, and these are the people you as a line member trust to look out for your corp. I will be running everything I can that is not op-sec or time sensitive through these channels to gather as much feedback as possible before making decisions. These people will need YOUR feedback to bring to the table for us all to grow together. (Requires you to be engaged and want the best for the members of this alliance)
The Politics
As previously stated, we are out of the war. We did not pay isk, we did not give moons, and we are not joining any other coalitions. We did not bow to anyone. We left because this wasn’t our war in the first place. We will not form to attack Vanguard/DRF sov. The only thing we are giving up is XVV, the system that connects B9E dead end constellations in immensea to tenerifis and to FCON space on the other side of immensea. We had no IHUB there and there are no money moons.
We are temporarily blue to stainwagon for ONE WEEK and then we will have a NIP. We under NO circumstances will violate this NIP. Get your stuff out of V-3. I will be reaching out to -A- to look at options for connecting our sov.
We are once again under NIP with FCON, we maintain our NIP with Provi. All of this is just our standard no cloaky camping, no hitting towers, no sov wanding. Roams/hunting pew pew are all acceptable, but do not interfere with sov/war fleets.
The Waffles contract is with us, and in the short term will stick around to guarantee our independaece is respected, but they will not be here for too much longer though.
The Future
Mid to long term our goals and options are open. They are ours again to make what we wish now that we aren’t stuck following a RUS agenda. We will not expand endlessly and unsustainably, and we will also actively avoid bluing everything around us. We have some of the best and most active pvp space and neighbours in the game, and there is no shortage of content for us, even without a big war.
Up Next: Standing orders
Hey Guys,
I would like to take some time to explain my vision for our combat forces going forward.
Simplified Doctrine
Over the past year, the number of doctrines you have been asked to keep at the ready has grown exponentially. Having so many ships creates three clear problems.1) Unless you are a pilot with >50M combat specific SPs you are probably having issues flying most of these doctrines competently if at all.
2) Having so many doctrines ships at the ready is a massive isk sink for everyone in the alliance.
3) Having so many doctrines is impossible for our market seeders to handle. While an argument can be made that having so many doctrines allows us maximum flexibility against our enemy, it is simply unrealistic to continue to have so many.Over the next couple of days, I will be working with the current FCs to come to an agreement on which doctrines will be our go-forward doctrines that allow us maximum flexibility while addressing the issue.
Increased Communication
One of the biggest problems we have had over the past several months is a lack of communication regarding overall strategy and alliance goals. Going forward, I will be looking to provide the alliance with weekly mails highlighting everything positive and negative that has happened over the past week. These mails will also highlight what our goals for the next week will be. Some details may have to remain opsec depending on the situation but I fully believe that it is easier to be motivated to fight if you know what we are doing and why we are doing it.
Enhance FC Capabilities
During the past war it became abundantly clear that we need more FCs. This includes more FCs willing to do small roam fleets and FCs willing to handle larger Strat Op fleets. As Benju indicated in his past mail, I am looking for people who are willing and capable of herding cats and take constructive criticism. Chances are you will whelp several fleets while learning. That is normal and to be expected. Please mail me in game or message on Discord if you are interesting in trying your hand at FCing. From there, I will try and match you up with existing FCs that play during your normal play time so they can backseat you and provide that constructive criticism I mentioned above.Enhanced Capital Capabilities
While we have several people who are competent capital pilots, my observations are that most people could use some practice. I previously attempted to establish routine capital practice on the test server and then the war happen. I will be looking to reestablish those cap practice sessions on the test server. We could always use more capitals so if you are thinking about training into one, DO IT.Standing Orders:
-Ensure all assets have been removed from –A– space within the next week. Assistance can be provided if you need help.
-Relax and unwind a bit now that the war is over. Random roams with friends and isk making are the priority for the next week or two.Regards,
Deveron
Military Director – Infamous
As of now it is clear massive changes are taking place, and it is yet to be seen how the line members will respond. All eyes will be watching DOTLAN alliance movements. Small skirmishes have happened across Catch in the last 72 hours which are not beyond the normal normal roaming fleets who pass through Catch. Content for the players will be available, the real question is how much? With Delve is undergoing a full Imperium invasion there does not appear to be any major activity in Catch. Will recent events provide the tinder to Catch fire? I will continue to cover things as they develop and as always please leave your comments below.
If you have a story or simply want me to fly with you for a day feel free to contact me via eve-mail. I am always looking for new leads and making new friends all over New Eden. Until next time, good hunting.
o7,
Sunbeam Diesel
