When people read about Eve Online on major gaming news outlets, they read about conflict, betrayal, huge fights in nullsec. Hopefully, this attracts new players to join us in the sandbox. CCP Games has made entry easy and free for new folks, but what are they looking for and how do they find it?

Mobadder Thworst is a longtime resident of the Crime and Punishment forums, highly experienced PVP-er, and expert can flipper. We spoke recently about what conflict used to be like, what happened, and what it’s like now. Back in 2010-2012, there was a lot of small gang fights, petty criminals flipping cans and starting scruffles that would escalate into gang brawls with the participants having a great time, or not so great time depending on the side they were on.

New players didn’t have far to go to find action, and often action found them. Mobadder’s main home was the newbie system of Akiainavas. He would get a suspect flag by stealing someone’s jet-canned ore. Then, hopefully, the miner would get angry and take the fight. The point was not to kill a miner, the point was to make someone interested in fighting, get them started in the most exciting PVP that can be had anywhere in gaming.

What drove the PVP was a real sense of conflict. Mobadder puts it like this:

“Eve is still a fascinating game: the depth of the PVP. Here’s the reality: In real life, we don’t have wars until we have conflicts. We don’t have fights without conflicts. You have a conflict with somebody. He takes something of yours. He does something you don’t like. Eve is one of the only games that had a solid mechanism where you could injure another player in a manner that replicated real life where you could have a real dispute. By the time you get done flipping a character you know a little about them. How they react to things. A lot of times you talk to them. There was some proper interaction there. It was a case of real conflict. That’s what made Eve real.”

When asked what changed, Mobadder responded:

“CCP has attempted to drive everybody in the direction of enjoying all this PVE when they missed the fact that they made the most sophisticated PVP game in history.”

So, what do you think, readers? Is conflict in Eve still as real as it was in 2010-2012? Is there more of a PVE focus than ever? Has CCP missed the mark by fettering highsec PVP via Crimewatch? Comment below!


This has been Moon Moon Burdy for EveNews24. Yellow-box me pls.

  • Rob

    I call BS on this capsuleer. ALL he was interested in was easy kills and causing dicontent. I bet he caused more players to say screw this game then he encouraged to stay and learn the ways of pvp. If this player wanted PVP he could just as easily of gone roaming in Null or low where he might find someone his own skill lvl. Instead he picks a noob starting system steals candy from kindergarden kids and says I did it for the content. BullSh4t I say again

    • xD xD xD

      Oy vey, new players should be left alone to mine in HighSec! That way they'll stick around!

      Sometimes I have to remind myself how gay 99% of the EvE player-base is. 99% carebears who wouldn't log on if there was a single-player campaign.

    • Mobadder

      The hatred of can flippers was one of the things that made Eve compelling. I have played good-guy as much as I’ve played bad-guy over the years, but it is the lack of can flippers that’s turned high-sac into a conflict and anger free zone.

      In 2012, Akiainavas was as dangerous as Tama… and when I was trying to learn to pvp, I went to both because they were the highest kill systems in Caldari space.

      I’ve killed noobs, but that was never the objective. They’re not that much fun.

      Back before crimewatxh, there were baiters outside station every day in Akiainavas.

      Go see the new player experience now. It is quiet and dead… spaceships drifting around quietly ina vacuum of boredom.

      This is what’s killing EvE.

  • Kriddius

    The recent moon changes transformed the most passive money generator in the into both a community building activity where a corp line member can have a real sense of contribution to their faction's earnings, and a hotspot for hunters to prey on juicy kills. It's PVE and PVP heaven and this guy says "real conflict" was enraging a miner to the point they commit to a one sided beat down? I wager he had friends nearby to support him with reps and boosts to take down untanked retrievers. Not even that, he preyed on rookies cutting their teeth in corvettes and T1 frigs. I rate CODE's version of "pvp" more honourable than whatever this cowardice was passed off as. And people ask why new players quit so quickly.
    CCP have done wonders for the game of late, but in the above scenario personally I'd like to see some more love for highsec. Wardec jumping to other corps, out of corp support, station "games" and suspect baiting are just some of the reasons the fringe systems of nullsec are arguably "safer" where people can enjoy a set-in-stone definition of friend and foe.

    • xD xD xD

      Oy vey goyim! Stop advocating for the end of my faggoty, community mining content! Ban all can flippers! Leave me and my PVE heaven alone! It's like 6 trillion Shoahs all at once!

  • Cloon

    8 years of stealing jetcanned ore from miners.. watch out, we got a badass here.

  • The14th

    Not taking any PvP analysis from a guy who was flipping jetcans in noob systems.

  • Dinsdale Pirannha

    Way to go under your the "new" leadership EN24.

    Why on earth would you post an article from an idiot like this who has driven so many from the game?

    • xD xD xD

      The change in leadership is an excellent step in the right direction. Go back to Reddit if you want hugs and puppies. This is now a WarDeccer comment section.

    • Mobadder

      You should check out the pvp tutorial that I have stickies in the new player section of the forums.

      I give back to the community, do you?

  • vrooomvrooom

    dafuq? this guy is an idiot par excellence. and his killboard tells a story as follows " hi , i flip cans of newbros in highsec."
    You could have taken literally anyone else…just check zkill , pick some dude with OBVIOUS experience and kowledge, ask him politely for an interview, maybe offer some reward for it. and you might end up with some interesting interview/point of view. this a complete waste.

  • Black Pedro

    Lol, so many tears in this thread over a guy who was just playing a spaceship game with new players.

    It's interesting that Eve's player numbers kept growing back when older players were actually interacting with new players in starter systems and growth only plateaued and started to decline after CCP sterilized many forms of interactions available for players in highsec with CrimeWatch 2.0 leaving them to wallow in the boredom of highsec missions or mining. I mean, many other things have changed along the way, but I can't help think that throwing new players into the lifeless snoozefest of highsec isn't helping things. I wonder if CCP knew then what they know now about the correlation between exploding newer player and player retention, they would have do the same thing?

    [youtube A92Ge2S8M1Y youtube]

    The NPE really should dump new players into a more interesting environment, more likely to have them interacting with other players, like maybe Faction Warfare? Despite what many have claimed, a safer starting area has done nothing to increase player retention, and arguably has just bored a generation of potential Eve players out of the game before they could find their place in New Eden.

    • vrooomvrooom

      eve is what u make it. if new players tend to mine in highsec and sooner or later get bored, its their fault. but dropping new players immediatly into FW and other pvp areas would be the most stupid thing to do, and would cause even more new players to leave very fast. not everyone likes to pvp.
      and again, eve is what u make it. u cant force people to do whatever…u like pvp? go for it. u like mining? go for it. and so on…. it doesnt matter at all where the starter areas are, if u look for certain things to do…ask people in chats, where to go and what to do, u will get some good infos….

      • Black Pedro

        > eve is what u make it. if new players tend to mine in highsec and sooner or later get bored, its their fault.

        Is it? How can you expect a truely new player joining the game and running the NPE to learn about most of the game that takes place other places than highsec? Honestly, it’s a miracle to me that people ever find their way to a nullsec or wormhole group given how little evidence of all that gameplay is in the game client or shown to new players. It’s CCP’s fault that the NPE funnels the new players to solo highsec mining and missioning careers with the predictable outcome that almost all of the new players quit. Resource Wars are a step in the right direction to get new players interacting with each other and more established players, but in addition to the cooperative game play, highsec could use some competition and fighting between players.

        I’m fine with CCP replacing unintuitive game mechanics like can flipping if they think they can do better, but they just went and removed them with CrimeWatch 2.0 turning highsec into practically safesec. Well, the carebear experiment has failed and I think CCP could do worse than adding some more risk and actual game play to highsec for once if they want to attract and keep players.

  • ffff

    I left eve a while ago, when I realized that with ccp seagull they put someone on the helm who's business vision is to lift the fantastic niche game eve was back then into mmo mainstream. It became obvious back then that ccp was transforming a game that would only retain a specific set of players, into a game based on a stream of more of a broad audience – which was in conflict with what the game was to me and my peers back then.
    This has not been working as they where hoping, and their solution seems to be to maintain that direction and become more and more what other mmo are.
    I used to love eve, it was my favorite hobby, but whenever I stumble over an article nowadays all I have left is a deep sadness, as I miss the harsh niche we used to have.

  • rogerthecabinboy

    Why the hell would you run an article with this piece of shit. Fucking faggot hi sec dickhead

    • Mobadder

      Thanks for the cogent and well written response.

      I would like to point out to the hate filled masses that
      1) 70% of the population plays exclusively in highsec… one could argue than null and low are mini-games by comparison. I enjoy the markets and the casual (non-job) feel of playing up here.
      2) since 2012, I’m not even describable as a griefer. Mining hulls have been buffed to the point that there is nearly no incentive to jet-can mine. Simply, the vast majority of the time I’m suspect I’ve stolen from a wreck someone was too lazy to loot in a belt… because that’s all there is out there. It’s extremely rare to find anything of actual value to take.

      No, my victims are bored opportunists who attack me. By an overwhelming majority, I’ve neither stolen from or harmed them when THEY initiate conflict… and to earn their aggro I accept open “safe” aggro against all players in highsec in a crowded mission system. And, by the way, I’ll be flying something I think everyone will want to engage (t1 frigate, hauler, etc…)

      I’m not even the opportunists since 2012, my victims are. And I have to fly so weak to get an engagement that literally everyone has the ability to beat me… with as simple an action as recruiting one friend.

      No, I’m actually a diversion from the boredom of eve and am more likely to retain them through a few moments of excitement than all the mining and PvE content you can muster up.

      They attack me. The fight is consensual… why the vitriol? At the risk level I carry, I can’t win on the level of guys who carry a good fleet. But the top level of my killboard has me flying a Merlin to best 2 T2 frigates, a battlecruiser, and a couple destroyers.

      Those fights were hard for me, but perhaps because I’m those things you called me.

      Please check the training documents that I wrote which are stickies in the new player help section of the forums… I’ve been trying to help people in this game for years.

  • xD xD xD

    Lol crying carebears everywhere. Make WarDec evasion a bannable offense. Grown men crying is what has kept this game alive. The reason it's dying is that all the guys who would make carebears cry have left the game. Now we're left with Redditors who orgasm over "such a great communityXD noobs welcome!!! c u at fanfestttt;)))".. It's sad. CCP is full of pussies. Carebears are doing nothing for their game.

  • Lul wut

    Pvp experienced my ass!
    Just ckeck zkill.. so fucking bad

  • anomymousse

    It is a riskfree environment in null sec these days, only carebearing, no wars, nothing to lost because of asset safety,… .
    Null has lost it risk these days and thus all the conflicts

  • Chargin ma lazer

    Highsec pvp…. hahahhahahaha fkn grubs

  • IskrasFemme

    "When people read about Eve Online on major gaming news outlets, they read about conflict, betrayal, huge fights in nullsec. Hopefully, this attracts new players to join us in the sandbox."

    Cause this, people just left, leave,left… CCP sucks this game with time!

  • Yaosus

    "Mobadder Thworst is a longtime resident of the Crime and Punishment forums, highly experienced PVP-er, and expert can flipper."


    • Mobadder

      Hey, this is Mo. I checked your killboard Yao. You have literally never won a fair fight, solo.

      You have no frame of reference.

      You rely on fleets if faction shiny to beat down the same population I fight. Difference is, I take the time to teach, help, and train new players.

      I’ve barely played since 2012 when the retribution patch hit because the entire casual pvp community quit. Miners is all there is now… and fleet badasses like you.

  • Can flipping ape

    So mobadder… 500 ship kills valued at 39 billion in 8 years……
    95% of them in rookie systems…
    en24 at its best

    • Mobadder

      Like most flippers, I have hardly played since 2012… and I was pure PvE for my first year.

      Hub humping produces prolific killboards, but limited interaction.

      Back then, there was an entire ecosystem of casual pvp. There were new pvp’ers hunting noobs. Experienced pvp’ers hunting new pvp’es, and extremely expert pvp’ers hunting experts.

      All of this happened in Akiainavas and the noobs would see it daily. It was interesting, and dark, and gritty.

      Now they log into absolute silence. Go see, local chat is abandoned, the population is about 1/3rd of what it was back then. It’s boring.

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