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INTRODUCTION AND CURRENT ISSUES

War is a way of life and of course – death. For EVE Online, war is weaved into the very ships we fly. Armed to the teeth and never built for destruction. We are the pinnacle of what it means to go to war.

Not long ago the war declaration mechanic saw an overhaul. While a better system than the previous one; it still is not where it should be. The most notable aspect war declarations are lacking is the ability to scale how deep one entity can legally engage another in empire space. On one end of the spectrum, wretched peace where you are not allowed to legally engage each other outside of kill rights and low security status. Then on the opposite end of the spectrum is all out war across all empire space, legally allowed to engage anything belonging to the enemy. There is also no legal way to target specific players or corporations outside of the entire corporation/alliance they belong to. You either go for the entire corporation/alliance, every ship class across all of New Eden, coughing up an enormous amount of money. Or – you do nothing.

The lack of options is crippling!

There are even issues with defending groups closing their corporation then reforming it rendering the war obsolete, wasting the ISK of those who declared the war. Corporation hopping to alt corps, running back to a Non-Player Corporation (NPC); all of these things and more invalidate the mechanic completely.

 

THE FALLOUT OF POOR WORDING

Before we dive deep into the changes I have in mind, it is important to take a few moments to mention some smaller things that need to be addressed. One being the notification that a war is about to start or end.

While the mails and notifications of a war declaration do their job, the one notifying that the war is coming to an end is worded very poorly. For veteran players we know there are still 24 hours people can legally fight after that second to last notification, but for younger players; it is confusing. I spent some time talking to groups who spend a great deal of their time taking part in war declarations. They brought up the confusion of the final notification and how many new players are killed during that 24 hours thinking the war was indeed over. Here is an example of such a notification:

CONCORD invalidates war declared by The Pursuit of Happiness against Northern Coalition.

From: CONCORD

Sent: 2014.05.04 20:36

CONCORD has declared this war invalid as it breaches one or more articles in the Yulai Convention. The war will be declared as being over after approximately 24 hours.

If you take away the very end part, in bold, and read it again; it says the war is over at that very moment the mail/notification was sent. The header plainly says Concord has invalidated the war, but only at the very end does it say in 24 hours it will be over. I understand EVE doesn’t need to be turned into some theme park game, but things like this need to be reworded and have better interaction with the players when a war starts and ends. Changing the notification wording is a start, but we can go further to improve the player experience. There should be more visual indications, especially with the changes I am suggesting. There should also be helpful indications and a User Interface (UI) on the game map. I’ll explain why this is needed a bit later in the article.

At the very least the notification/mail should start with, “In 24 hours the war will end…”

 

REAL VICTORY CONDITIONS

There is a victory condition in place now. The issue is that even after a surrender is agreed upon; there will still be 24 hours of war. Fighting can still take place and in fact does. This flaw becomes even more apparent for a group who has several wars and is not easily able to determine who is who on the overview. A group surrenders and is still being shot up regardless. The end effect is the mechanic is rarely used and if so only for a bit of extra cash to milk from the target. It echos the same reason why ransoms never really work. Anyone who pays is killed regardless and is out additional Interstellar Kredit (ISK) for nothing.

Perhaps the intent is so it cannot be used to grief smaller groups, but in the end it is broken. This needs to be iterated on badly. Not just changing the war to stop completely once a side surrenders, but also look into the possibility of other victory conditions outside of one side cutting a check. Introduce a variety of conditions that could be met.

 

SCALING

Instead of declaring war against an entire alliance across all of empire space; I want to see more scaling of the scope. The ability to not just pick an entire alliance, but the option to go after a specific corporation or even a single individual. As you scale down the list of targets, the price would drop as well. In addition, the ability to scale down on where these legal conflicts can take place. From the entirety of empire space (high and low) down to regions, constellations and even a single system. Again, the cost would scale down along with it. Finally the ability to scale on ship classes.

With these three customizable sliders on the war declaration mechanic we are able to change the scope of the conflict to things that would fall under blockades, sanctions and even personal vendettas. This would kick open the door for smaller entities to actually be able to affect the ultra large alliances. Instead of having to declare war on the entire alliance, spending up to 500 million ISK a week and only having a select few legal targets to go after; you can be a bit more thrifty with your money and go after the actual targets that will be empire space.

 

WHO, WHAT AND WHERE

There are three sliders to adjust. Target, location and ship class. Each category has several variations that dictate the impact the war will be. Because it has many options calling it a war declaration is not entirely fitting anymore. Things start to act more towards sanctions, blockades and if on a single person scale, something like bounty hunting.

The only limit on who, what and where would come down to your wallet. The possibilities of the type of legal combat becomes limitless. You could do an empire wide scale against an entire alliance for capital class ships. Then add another in a specific constellation for battle-cruisers and larger against a specific corporation in the same alliance. Or maybe you just want to go after freighters in Jita only. Sure it would be very cheap, but you need to remember we are talking just the one ship class in one system. They could easily use haulers in that system to bypass being a legal target in Jita, move the goods to the next system and then board a freighter and go about their way. So these things would need to be taken into consideration.

The important thing is both sides have options for how far they want to go with the war and how they can work around it. Instead of the current all or nothing we have now.

 

UNNECESSARY COSTS

How much does a war declaration cost? It costs 50 million ISK, plus an additional cost for each member in the target corporation/alliance above 51. It will now start to increase with the 51st member and reach the ceiling of 500 million ISK at 2000 members.

Unfortunately, and I could be wrong about this but it includes characters that belong to an account no longer subscribed. Basically making the attacker pay for additional targets they will never have the chance to engage. To a degree the same can be said about characters in a group that serve as nothing more than cyno alts, Player Owned Structure (POS) stront alts and things like that. More targets that the attacker will never be able to have as a target. War fees should never take into consideration players who are not subscribed.

With this new system you could single out targets you know can be a legitimate target and pay for that. Perhaps the logistics corporation of an alliance. Maybe it is simply 20 players who will actually be in empire space. The fee for a corporation of 20 would be vastly smaller than eating the cost to declare war against 10,000 players – of whom most will never be in empire space during the entire war.

 

FROM GRIEFER TO TEACHER

What I am proposing is ⅓ of the war declaration fee be directly deposited from the attacker to the defenders wallet. I know, it sounds completely insane. Why on earth would an attacker pay the defender anything? Allow me to explain and try to have an open mind.

Making ISK for a new player is actually pretty rough. Outside of scamming or some other uncommon thing; they will be counting every single ISK. Sure they can stay with the NPC and farm missions, but they decide to broaden their game-play. Perhaps they are with some other friends that are new to the game. Basically they are new blood. Something the game desperately needs.

Enter the griefer group. Basically players who have tons of skill points, experience and most likely billions upon billions of ISK to fund themselves as they look for easy prey. They are too cowardly to look for combat in low sec or even faction warfare, because they might actually be shot at. Essentially, in my opinion, a cancer to the game. A cancer because every action they take with that mindset does a tremendous amount of damage to the game without ever adding anything positive to it. Again, cancerous cowards.

So this griefer group targets the new players and using a variety of tools is able to track down all the new players and keep them from actually undocking from the game. From adding them to a watch list to search agents, the new players don’t stand a remote of a chance against the griefers. They don’t have the skill points, the knowledge of game mechanics, the ISK, the ships and most likely not even the same number of pilots to even remotely compete against the griefers. They have no chance.

Now when you factor in the ⅓ war declaration fee income things change drastically. Now this small corporation of new players have a sizable amount of income. Which can be used to replace their tech 1 ships and maybe even hire some mercenaries to aid them. Combine that with the varying stipulations of the war declaration; they can decide to scale down on the ship they want to fly with and not be a legal target. Even relocate to areas that are not part of the war declaration. They now have options. Even if they decide to fight the griefers and lose, the ⅓ fee income will help supplement them.

Now this new player corporation is learning combat. Learning mechanics and not being griefed back to an NPC or deciding to leave the game completely. The once waste of space griefer group have actually funded the new players’ learning process. They still get to go after easy targets, but the degree of damage they want to inflict will dictate how much they are funding the defending group. Are they really griefing if the new players are becoming more experienced, learning and even making a profit? Something to think about for a group looking to grief only.

I’m sure some of you are still scratching your head in confusion, but hopefully the longer you think about it you will agree it helps. Even if it does not make sense in any real world environment. If it squares the circle, so be it – no matter how odd.

 

SOMETHING TO FIGHT FOR

As I mention earlier, there is very little to fight over. The only two things that fit this category is a POS and Player Owned Customs Office (POCO). These two things can easily be attacked in low security space without having to issue a war declaration, so it really only comes into play for high security space. There needs to be more goals/objectives during the war declaration period so that the declaration fee does not cost as much as the goal/objective itself.

Regarding a POS in high sec; there is another problem. If the defending side thinks they will not be able to successfully defend the tower; they unanchor everything and pack it up leaving nothing. I’m not implying a defender should risk everything, but there needs to be some risk in losing assets. Even if that means increasing the benefit of risking those assets in war.

Perhaps there could be some things that could not be removed. Maybe something in relation to where a group has their headquarters and offices. Something that can be interacted with if a group decides to not fight at all. The POCO has a decently high risk when you consider extremely large groups already have a monopoly on almost all the good planets. We need some entry level objectives to battle over.

There are many possibilities that this could entail and would help bridge the gap between existing in high security space compared to the rest of the game. It doesn’t need to be crippling to the side that decides not to fight for it, but offers a bit of an incentive to do something instead of sitting on one’s hands.

NO – THE COST OF SHIP CLASSES IS NOT BACKWARDS

It does look backwards when you consider the value of each class, but it is by design. With it scaling this way a group always has options of scaling down to a ship class to mitigate the war. Players start with the skill to fly frigates and the learning process takes them through the other ship classes as they scale up. This also makes it more costly for griefer groups to prey on new players. To reach a level of ships new players are flying, they will be paying a good amount of ISK to do it. ISK that will seem like a fortune to the new players. ⅓ going to their wallet. Something to keep in mind.

If it were the other way around it would be ultra cheap to lock out new players and be dramatically in favor of players who scale up to larger ship classes to escape the war declaration conditions. It also allows players the option to keep doing missions as they can choose lower level missions to do with their smaller ships. So they are not entirely locked out of making income. When you think about it this way, I assure you it makes sense.

NPC NO LONGER 100% SAFE

Right now it is impossible to have any legal action taken against players in a non-player corporation. One of the main reasons is to keep griefers in check a bit. One of the side effects is NPC is very commonly used by null alliances for empire logistics. Even when the alliance is under a war declaration, the logistics remains 100% safe behind the NPC – avoiding all risk. This needs to be addressed.

One of the great things about a new war mechanic is the ability to target NPC players. As much as I would love to allow all NPC ship classes to qualify, I think the only one allowed to be selected is the capital class for now. Perhaps in the future with enough balancing on the cost of the war declaration it could be extended to include more if not all ship classes. This is thanks to the ⅓ fee going towards the defenders. Going after a new player for all of empire space would be very costly and the whole time the new player is being showered with ISK. You begin to ask at what point are you going from being a threat to being an angel showering them with that amount of ISK? I also believe the sooner players are involved with combat with other players the better. But it needs to allow the ability for them to mitigate it to a degree instead of the 100% everything anywhere mechanic it is now.

There is a way to become involved in a war while in NPC beyond capital ships, which I will explain next.



REAL RISK FOR NEUTRAL ASSISTING

One of the biggest problems with empire war declaration is neutral assistance. This can be in the form of gang links and logistics giving a group a tremendous advantage. So much that it is not uncommon for the majority of characters involved in a war to be outside of the actual groups who are legally part of the war.

Sure anyone who provides assistance via a module like remote armor or sensor boosting becomes suspect flagged allowing anyone to engage them, but the flag only lasts for 15 minutes and most likely involves so many that if someone were to attack one of these it would just result in other alts or buddies of the target remote repairing your target. Which of course means if you are doing this on a station they could easily dock and grab a combat ship. Then undock and engage you back. Except they have an army of logistics propping them up and most likely – you do not. Thus forcing you to drag along alts and or friends to perform logistics on you as well, resulting in some odd stalemate. Hardly compelling game-play.

So how does one increase the risk of neutral assistance without flat out disallowing it? The best way is to simply include them into the war situation when they do assist. If their wallet does not have the ISK needed to do so whatever module that would be doing the assist does not activate.

Let’s say you are a Guardian and your friend is in an assault frigate engaging one of their war targets in a battle-cruiser. You decide to be ‘that guy’ and start to remote repair your friend.

You will automatically issue a war declaration against your friends target. The extent of this new war declaration is for the system you are currently in, against your friends target and anyone else in the associated war declaration with them. Also taking into consideration the smallest ship involved in the engagement. The smallest ship being used in this engagement being used is your friend in an assault frigate. So the ship class your instant war declaration will be for frigates and larger.

So for that specific situation your wallet will be automatically charged whatever that specific war declaration would be for the location, person involved and ship size. Just like a normal war declaration, this new one will last for a week. If you do not have enough ISK to cover this, you will not be able to use any assistance module to aid them. This also includes links.

So whilst it is still possible to call on your friends for help, it really only can be done once for that specific system and will not be for free. Just as stated above, ⅓ of that fee will be going towards the target entity. You are either neutral or assisting; impossible to be both.

 

A TWO WAY STREET

Whatever conditions the attacker picks, the thing to remember it is very much a two way street. Here is an example:

Flameburst corporation declares a sanction (war) against Talon corporation. The conditions:

Location: Coriault constellation
Target: Talon corporation which is part of Eagle alliance
Ship Type: Battle-cruiser

Even though the Talon corporation is part of an alliance, it does not mean the rest of the alliance can legally attack Flameburst. Sure they could provide assistance via remote repairs or gang links, but it would fall under the neutral assistance rules as described earlier.

Flameburst could fly around the Coriault constellation in cruisers and smaller ships. If they come across a member of the Talon corporation in a battleship, they can choose to engage them. Remember the ship type selected also includes any larger ship classes. So they can legally attack the Talon corporations battleship while in the Coriault constellation. Remember that even though Flameburst was the initiator of the war declaration, it means the situation could easily be reversed with the Talon corporation flying in Dodixie with heavy assault cruisers finding and attacking a Flameburst Raven in a mission.

If both corporations are flying cruisers and smaller, neither can legally attack each other. If both find each other in battle-cruisers they both can legally engage at will. Back to the previous situation where one is in a heavy assault ship and finds the other in a battleship; the battleship will have to wait for the heavy assault ship to attack it before it can defend itself.

BOUNTY HUNTING AND INCENTIVES

On a previous article, I touched on changing the bounty payouts on ships if they were war targets and if they were on the most wanted list. I want to emphasize that again:

An additional 10% bounty is paid if it is a war target and or an additional 10% if they are the most wanted list. This means that if the target falls under both – the total bounty payout is 40% of the kill value.

 

CONCLUSION

This section of the sandbox needs some serious iteration. While the specific changes I have proposed is not the only way to fix it, something similar that offers the players a variety of options to engage each other is needed. Not just how to go about war declarations, but how to mitigate it if so desired.

The formula used to determine how much the war fee is really up to balance team at CCP. Perhaps security status would affect the amount? Other aspects? It really depends on how far they want to take it. I thought about an option to adjust how long the war declaration could be, but decided not to include a fourth slider. A week still feels about right.

I believe the key to helping new players want to stay in the game involves a few aspects that need work. I have mentioned in the past how terrible things like missions are. Constantly teaching players to be awful at PvP. Another one is the war declaration mechanics. When they are introduced to them, it usually involves a situation where they have no control or time to learn. I believe these changes would help tremendously.

Finally I would like to remind you that reading all of this gives an initial impression this system would be complicated. It actually would be rather simple on the player end. After all you are just deciding who, what and where. Perhaps adjusting to a new overlay for the map that shows where wars are and the conditions, but I think that is a good thing and the opportunity to revamp the map system at the same time would be nice.

-Marlona Sky

[ Feel free to discuss the article, as well as all things EVE on our forums. ]

  • Garandras

    lol wat is this garbage..

    while i like that you have gone to great effort, the war mechanic in this game is espionage, the idea to lock down your opponent so they are unable to compete against you. If you want to be safe from the war dec, pay the ransom if one is offered or fight/pay someone else to fight for you

  • Sigh

    Players that partake in hs war decs are nothing but coward pvp wannabe carebears.
    Like any advanced civilisation would allow their citizens to shoot and kill each other, it is a bad game mechanic, there should be no pvp in HS at all.
    Thats what LS and Null is for and thats why CCP made LS and Null the largest part of the game.
    Any player that ganks in HS should be banished to LS for a game time period not RL time.
    Mabe CCP should bring in WOW battlegrounds for the wanker HS keyboard worriors, if they wanna hide in HS and shoot players.
    Ive a suggestion to those HS cough cough pvpers, get out from HS and go NPC null and you will get all the small gang pvp they could ask for, though id bet the npc syndicate folks would rape them stupid

  • Dorsey

    Targeted war decs against specific players? That’s an incredibly terrible idea. As things stand right now, HS wardecs are highly predatory and very much favor the offensive party. Yeah, let’s make it so you can grief specific players right out of the game while their friends stand by helpless. What good are the wardec fees when a group of players with 5x your SP each are constantly killing you or station camping you?

  • guest

    yeah, um..nice idea…but bullshit, obviously not really thought through

    1. u srsly think a new player would stay in the game when he is limited to ship spinning for 1+ weeks just because u pay him 33% of the wardec cost ? Or just because u effectively replace the T1 frig he just lost to a T2 fitted HAC or T3 ?

    2. several alliances have a training, or newbie, corp. your idea allows wankers to pick them off specifically without including the alliance vets.

    3. allow to declare war on NPC players ? dealing with ppl leaving a wardecced crop ? so u basically want to force (new) players to fight in highsec, the griefer, the ones u called a cancer, would surely welcome that…

    4. declaring war on capitals in *insert trade hub*. u ever realised that alot of stuff can’t be transportet in anything smaller then a freighter ? i wanna see you move that with a hauler anywhere. Any idea how many trips your hauler has to do to move the cargo of a filled freighter, how much time that takes ? What about logistics corps (frogs come to mind), transporters for friends, corps, alliances ?

    the whole idea would most likely have catastrophic effects on Eve, almost solely benefitting griefers and other wankers, that want a 1337 killboard but dun have the spine to leave highsec.

  • lee

    Who ever wrote this needs to take their face for a shit.

  • Jibberjabber

    Jesus Christ… all jokes and trolling aside… EN25 seriously needs some new writers. There’s only so many half baked bullshit ideas people are going to read before they stop reading entirely.

    • jibberjabber

      and yes I wrote ‘EN25′

  • Arakki

    Soo, you want a 100% accurate tool to check how many subscribed pilots CFC has?

    Get better spais.

  • sxgvbs

    wardecs serve no purpose other than to help cowards like marmite pick off single targets undocling from a trade hub

    the whole mechanic should be removed

    • Yawn

      How about flying smart and not being a bitch about things that expose the fact that you’re shit?

      Please link to the wholly unnecessary and expensive loss that you suffered so that we may all share your grief.

      • Bearhunter

        Nobody with even half a brain loses ships to marmite. That their kb is filled none the less just shows how bad most of the people playing this game really are. Marmite are carebears though, removing wardeccing would make them coudle up in a corner and cry themselves to sleep. I enjoy beartears, so this seems like a pretty good idea to me.

        • Nee Naw

          “Nobody with even half a brain loses ships to marmite.”

          Victim alert. Waaaaahmbulance on the way. Remain calm. Do not undock.

          • lel marmite

            Don´t be mad just because you know it´s true. I don´t even check local anymore when i´m in highsec. It´s not that instalcking gnosis and sebo cynas (lol seriously) can kill anything but unstabbed haulers. I could teach you lowbreds a lesson or two about getting shit done. I ain´t even mad.

  • Marlona Skoblin

    Glevon Goblin, see ? You’re not the worst anymore ! There’s still hope !

  • Red Teufel

    The War Dec system does work as it is. If you plan on going to war with a newb corp of 10 or 15 don’t expect anything to shoot except maybe a gank. you won’t achieve anything. You need to war groups that have something to lose like a tower, poco, logistics. If you want pvp go to lowsec or null.

  • mdsloop

    i think there are something missing. how about wardecs where you never see any engagement and the “warDecer” will have to pay a fine due to the lack of kills? it should be a valid option not to fight or even bring so many friends that the wardecer refuses to fight… so how about a fine system that penalizes none willingness to engage? especially the wardecer.

    • BS

      Well it does… Wardec is not for free you know

  • 2.4

    NIG…NIG…NIG…SPIC…SPIC…SPIC…You’re a fag!

  • Ciaphas Cyne

    rather amusing seeing the response here and on reddit. bad idea is bad

  • Parrforthecourse

    How to deal with high sec wardec greifers:
    Step 1) Shut the f$@k up in local (I mean it, SHUT UUUUUUUPPPPP) and do not get baited into conversations…period!
    Step 2) Jump into a blank clone.
    Step 3) Jump into a velator (or rookie ship of your choosing)***
    Step 4) Wait outside a station and let them shoot you (and dock BEFORE they pod you…if you get podded REMEMBER to get a new clone BEFORE repeating Steps 2 and 3.
    Step 5) Laugh at the epic velator kills they get and wait for the wardec to run out.
    ***if you want to be a real smartass about it, fit your velator with a cloak…play the warp game…cloak up, and taunt in local…WARNING/DISCLAIMER: this does carry the risk of pissing off the wardeccers into constantly hunting you down and making life generally miserable for you.

    • Roche

      +1

  • 1337 PVP FTW

    Get a fucking life you piece of shit griefer. Man I would love to kick the fuck out of some of these people in rl. Game and internet griefers are weak little bitches, if nature gave them a bigger stronger body and they could get off their computer for an hour a day to go to the gym and get some muscle tone, would be bullies in rl. But because they can’t they get their psychotic aggression out behind the keyboard. It fucking sad, take a marshal art or something. Get that aggression out doing something positive. Weight lifiting and Thai boxing works for me.

    • Homophobic John

      Shitpost of the year.

    • lee

      Thai boxing i’d pull you’re legs put of their sockets if you came at me saying that

    • Midtown East

      INTERNET TOUGH GUY ALERT

    • Van Damned

      Obvious troll is obvious. Nobody is this much of a retard and still permitted access to the internet.

      ‘Marshal art’. Lulz.

    • 1337 PVP FTW

      I agree everyone has to be a fat fucking slob like you guys if they casually play a hardcore online game. Go fucking die from heart attacks already you fat fucking shit bags.

      • Why do they call you cuntface?

        Your idiocy is legendary.

  • Alexis Nightwish

    I agree 100 % that war mechanics need to be revised, but this is a terrible idea.
    Allowing war against a subset of a group largely defeats the purpose of grouping up: mutual defense. What’s the point of being in a corp if you can be singled out directly, or in an alliance if your corp can? Also allowing targeted wars in such a way just gives power to the greifers.
    Imagine a group of assholes who decide to greif a single player. These guys all pay a small fee and for a week the victim has a dozen people who have free reign to make the game unplayable. So the victim wonders, rightly so, what the point of being in alliance is. He drops to an NPC corp, but the torment doesn’t end there! You can single out people in NPC corps too!

    Poorly thought out, overly complex, and highly abusable idea is poorly thought out, overly complex, and highly abusable.

    • Arbosa

      +1

  • SukMe

    First and foremost. The mechanics don’t need revising. Its only griefers that want war mechanics to be revised and prevent newbies leaving their corps or moving or changing corps, and alliances or closing corps. Griefers want the reward of making sure the person leaves eve, thus extinguishing the new player base from eve, and thus also not inviting new players that have no idea to play the game. Griefers use this trait as a means to force players into what they never intended. At present moment all i see is whining from griefers so they can do more damage. All i see is a very soon to be dying eve. But i guess not matter what anyone says, the griefers don’t care, because this is their sole purpose, to move from game to game, and destroy it.

    Are we not meant to invite new real new players, not veterans with another 100 accounts. 60% of eve is already alt accounts. It pathetic that this is a reward system for chasing away many of the new player base. I disagree completely and that war mechanics are good as they are. It works both ways, if you want to grief, and if you want to be an asshole, then waste isk. War dec, and let them close the corp, keep wasting isk. Instead of whining and getting ccp to join in on your escapade for chasing away new players, rather think of new ways to do things. You want to grief new players, let them close corp, and waste your isk. IT WORKS BOTH WAYS. They have a means to get back at you the same way you have a means to get at them. You are asking for everything to go your way. Stop whining. Use that piece of crap called a brain between ur ears. That’s what its there for. If you don’t like wasting isk, stop war decking like a moron. If you don’t like the guy, and they close the corp, and invalidating the war, then simply do what pirates do, gank them anyways. Good grief, talk about whiners. It been made public on a number of blogs about eve being a shit game and new players being griefed and so on. Maybe once the REAL new player that never heard of eve and want to try stop joining eve, and the current player base gets bored and stops playing for a while, then we shall see how much “fun” ur having. In fact, here is a nice piece, EVE ONLINE MUST DIE. That way you can all stop your damn bitching. You all sound like whining women with wet nappies on.

    • 1337 PVP FTW

      Love it :)

    • Former Newbie, didn’t stay

      +1

    • Newbie friendly

      sounds a lot like you are a hi-sec griefer…

    • Concord Bribing

      this guy has his Stupidity lvl to 5 get off the rage roids, and smoke some healing herbs..

      bad things are

      It’s a decent change with bad mechanics UNTIL you flip the cost mechanics for “targets” and “location” then it becomes interesting… large alliance can be dec’d for less but a bounty on one person’s head would cost a ton (much more then) the current 500mill.. I’ld Gladly kick down your station door kill you and shit on your couch, for a billion isk a week… no locking down the hubs or bottle necks… one more thing all indy ships are rated the same a frigs… gank a freighter the old fashion way or stay in the blue doughnut and press F1 if you can finds something to shoot…

      Security

      • SukMe

        I am sure as hell no high sec griefer. Oh ofcourse you would say go stay in the blue donut, because that what u assholes do. You grief and force people to join the powerblocs in null sec. or the other screwed up donut. EVE MUST DIE. EVE MUST DIE. It the only way….and as for you Concord Bribing. You can SukMe. I am tired of all the whining little bitches with wet nappies on. I don’t grief, i work hard to get the little bit of screwed up isk i get. You jackass monkeys with your hundreds of billions of isk can go play with a kite in a RL hurricane. CCP refuses to fix the right things. Players are leaving. EVE MUST DIE. Its the only way the monkeys with too much isk and tell everyone else to go get f**ked will lose and get f**ked themselves for once. Then we see who rages and bitches and whines like wet nappy bitches.

        • Concord Bribing

          WTH are you on,

          isk and assets come from being Smart and Quiet not hard work … I learned to how play just like everyone else should have… I fly with alot of ops in low sec.. My favorate thing to do is catch supers with their pants down, for the giggles.. but some think it’s news?look we got some RL Cybernetic Subprocessors to help get your IQ out of the single digits…

          if i find a noob in lowsec, i’m obligated to shoot it, it’s the ROE of EVE.. but i give them money for a few new ships and give the good ol’ GF in local… most of them are happy to die they then try again in a properly tanked ship… High-sec ganking and camping a gate equates to mining for me that’s a waste of time lowsec

          loudmouth noobs like you are the real reason for perma-decs starting and ppl get camped out, you don’t know your place this game. Running off at the mouth just makes it worse for the people around you… My proposal changes it to an anti-Griefing stance but the option is open for those special goblins of eve…

          And what’s Wrong with that. if i just have to pay alot get tards like you to be singled out for a price and the rest of the corp/alliance can do as they please. that’s a good thing and it should be expensive, but special case

          TL;DR …takes this money, and grab your ankles

          More tears Plz i payed good money for this content

        • Concord Bribing

          WTH are you on,

          isk and assets come from being Smart and Quiet not hard work … I learned to how play just like everyone else should have… I fly with alot of ops in low sec.. My favorate thing to do is catch supers with their pants down, for the giggles.. but some think it’s news?look we got some RL Cybernetic Subprocessors to help get your IQ out of the single digits…

          if i find a noob in lowsec, i’m obligated to shoot it, it’s the ROE of EVE.. but i give them money for a few new ships and give the good ol’ GF in local… most of them are happy to die they then try again in a properly tanked ship… High-sec ganking and camping a gate equates to mining for me that’s a waste of time lowsec

          loudmouth noobs like you are the real reason for perma-decs starting and ppl get camped out, you don’t know your place this game. Running off at the mouth just makes it worse for the people around you… My proposal changes it to an anti-Griefing stance but the option is open for those special goblins of eve…

          And what’s Wrong with that. if i just have to pay alot get tards like you to be singled out for a price and the rest of the corp/alliance can do as they please. that’s a good thing and it should be expensive, but special case

          TL;DR …takes this money, and grab your ankles

          More tears Plz i payed good money for this content

  • Deifirtep

    My only problem with the authors article is found at the very beginning: sorry, but sometimes you have to be able to escape griefers that wardeck you by leaving corp, leaving alliance, closing your doors, etc. It may seem like wasted money to the attacker, but sometimes, that is what the attacker wants: to cause as much disruption as possible.

    Personally, I love the proposal you give of more options for Wardeccing. To be able to target an individual or, an entire system a target may operate in would be a welcome change for many wardeccers. Obviously this tips the hand of the attacker, however, since they are telegraphing their intent. But that can be just as useful depending on the objective.

    Excellent ideas, thank you.

  • my 2 cents

    My 2 cents here is the only things which need to be changed for the war system is;
    1) Disallow 3rd partys to interfere i.e those who arnt an active part of the war… a gang of logi, who are essentially immune from reprisal.
    2) Prevent chars from leaving a corp while the war dec is active, meaning you have to surrender, ending the war dec.

    Yes being able to wardec a specific corp in an alliance i think is a good idea.
    No specific chars and ships in specific areas… this just seams like more tools for greifers

  • my 2 cents

    My 2 cents here is the only things which need to be changed for the war system is;
    1) Disallow 3rd partys to interfere i.e those who arnt an active part of the war… a gang of logi, who are essentially immune from reprisal.
    2) Prevent chars from leaving a corp while the war dec is active, meaning you have to surrender, ending the war dec.

    Yes being able to wardec a specific corp in an alliance i think is a good idea.
    No specific chars and ships in specific areas… this just seams like more tools for greifers

  • Surloc

    Interesting ideas, but flawed. If there is no way to avoid war decs a large part of Eve will quit. The only way avoid the subscription loss caused by allowing people in NPC corps to be war deced is to make wars fun. Like wise people need to be able to leave corps under war decs or a large part of Eve will quit. You can’t approach this by locking people into wars as people who don’t like wars simply won’t play. What we need for more fun is:
    1) Just concord neutral logi, and link alts if their safety is not on.
    2) Insure that the attacker has skin in the game, and can be forced into a fight at the time of the defenders choosing. Other wise the declaring corp will simply choose t fight only when odds are entirely in their favor.
    3) Put in a lot more interesting deployables for individual pilots to deploy that are subject to wars. Also make it so if you yank them up early there is some loss. Give them reinforcement timers set by the owner.

    Also I don’t think you should be able to wardec a single person or corp in a larger group. There should be some safety in numbers. Some reason to join a corp. Some reason for a corp to join an alliance. Right now there is little enough reason for HS folks to not just create their own single player corp.