I’ve been thinking about this for awhile. Ever since I wrote my post about a module that could cloak you from local chat. CCP Explorer replied that ideas concerning system intel should not rely on local as an intel source. The way we currently use local, it’s a direction CCP wants to move away from.
We’ve heard this before. Every Fanfest, every final weekend of the Alliance Tournament, CCP Soundwave trots out the idea of removing local as an intel source, similar to how local works for wormhole space. He’s been doing this for at least two years, maybe longer, but CCP has made not a single move in this direction.
Rhavas recently made a post, his 100th, about how to remove local as intel, and what additional components would need to be added to put intel gathering into the player’s domain. It’s a good post. He goes into a lot of detail. A crap tonne of new modules, new mechanics. The kit and kaboodle, plus some.
For my 500th post, I talk about how I think CCP can get rid of local. I approach this differently than Rhavas, though. I like to look for solutions within the game, by utilizing what already exists, and assuming that modifications to those existing frameworks would be less time intensive for CCP. (That may not be the case, but only CCP knows how modifiable and extensible their systems are.)
Local as Intel
Local chat would behave in lowsec and nullsec as it does in wormhole space. You do not appear, until you speak.
In highsec, local would continue to act as is. Call it the CONCORD rule, if you need a roleplay reason for this. CONCORD is all knowing and that information is available to everyone in highsec. It is the benefit and downside to living in highsec. You know everyone who in system with you, and everyone in system knows you’re there.
The Directional Scanner
With intel gone, we need a new source of discovering intel. I propose a large extension to directional scanning functionality.
First, allow us to create multiple d-scanning tabs. (CCP can limit this to five, as they do with the overview, if they wish.)
Second, each tab would have its own filter and scanning distance properties, similar to the overview tab filters, but the directional scanner is no longer tied to the active overview tab.
Third, the directional scanner would have to include all-new data fields. Character name. Character affiliation. Standings icons (similar to the icon column on the overview.) These new fields wouldn’t be available all the time, but in certain situations (see Active and Passive Pinging below.)
These filters can be imported and exported, so that alliances can create pre-made filters for their members.
Skill: Directional Scanning
A new skill called Directional Scanning would be available, available under the Electronics section. It should be an 8x skill (the best scouts should require an investment in time.)
Anyone can d-scan without the Directional Scanning skill, but their scans are limited to passive pinging only (see below), and a maximum distance of 10AU.
Every skill level of Directional Scanning increases the maximum scanning range by 5AU. So, someone with Direction Scanning V could scan up to 35AU distance. This, of course, means that CCP would need to find a solution to the 232 km d-scan limitation, something I’m sure they’re capable of accomplishing.
Active and Passive Pinging
If you do not have Directional Scanning trained, you are limited to only passive directional scanning.
Passive scanning allows you to scan without notifying any players that you are scanning. The information you receive is reduced, limited to ship name and type (the current functionality of d-scanning.)
Active scanning notifies players that they’ve been scanned (perhaps an active scanning appears above their HUD for six seconds, and maybe there’s a muted audio alert as well.) Active scanning gives an increased amount of information, ship name and type, as well as character name, character affiliation, and the standings icon. Potentially it could give information related to current crimewatch status (suspect flagging, etc.)
Every directional scanning tab has two buttons. One for passive scan and another for active scan. (Of course, the active scan button is unavailable to people who have Directional Scanning untrained.)
Active scanning does not always notify a player that they are being scanned. If the scanned player has a Directional Scanning skill at a lower rank than the player scanning, then they do not receive the active ping notification.
Thoughts?
That’s about it for the idea. Granted, it is far simpler than Rhavas’ idea, but perhaps it’s more attractive to CCP due to it using existing game components, and having a lower development cost. As always, interested in reading your thoughts.
You can read more of Poetic Stanziel’s opinions at his Poetic Discourse blog.
The only thing I like about this idea is the d-scan tabs
To me this just means another nerf to 0.0 income, as ratters would die more to cloaky bombers / gangs or rat less due to cloaky AFK players. With the current local mechanics PvPers still get plenty of PvP action if they want (roams vs. home def fleets), while ratters can still do what they enjoy / need to do to fuel their PvP ambitions (shooting red crosses). Also, moving local to constellation chat would just make AFK cloaking (that we see now as an annoyance) much easier, as it would only take one cloaky bomber to ruin the ratting to players. The difference I see between 0.0 and WHs is that in higher class Whs you simply need to rat in fleets to survive, while you can easily rat alone in 0.0 (also, risk / reward ratio doesn't change that much, as sleepers are more profitable than regular 0.0 rats). This would also mean that ratters would look for some less risky way of making ISK (which may remove them as targets from 0.0 altogether), which would probably make 0.0 even more lonely place to be in.
you don’t want local?
fine. go to w-space.
How accurately this comment shows that u didnt even read past the 2nd line.
Why the FUCK do you even consider this SHIT? Seems that indeed the POETS are IDIOTS.Are you EVEN in null or low sec? Do you think that current local somehow prevents PvP engagements?
Well, moron, imagine a local like in WH, WITHOUT the WH isk.NOFUCKINGBODY will undock.Well, SOME will undock, but that means even lesser PvP than now.
Gee, go F yourself.
Passive pinging, is a dumb idea. It just means that someone can farm sites and run missions in dangerous space without having to pay any real attention to the game. The only way the would work is if passive scanning required a module that had so big penalties.
This ludicrous idea would add a ridiculous amount of time onto roams in null. People and their daft ideas never fail to surprise me. "If its not broken, don't try to fix it".
There is a reason CCP issnt touching local and wont in the next few years! Why?
Because unlike WH's in Lowsec and 0.0 space cyno's do exist and it'll cause problems no matter how you approach it. Removing local means that titan brige and blackops bridge becomes the single most powerful tool of war and thats just not what CCP wants.
well said, sir.
fucking dumb idea
A huge number of players young and old don't know what dscan even is (hisec guys and oblivious others). Next to that, those that know what it is supply another staggering number that don't know how to use it effectively. Asking for such a dependence on dscan while yes would force them to learn would cause a lot of issues in the community…making the eve learning cliff of death even more so. It's a nice idea and many of us could utilize but I know plenty of "vets" that haven't spent the time in the past and certainly won't in the future learning to use a more complex tool..they'll rage quit "eve is dead all over again".
If anything..
Hisec/lowsec – active local update
Nullsec – delayed update
WH – the same as chat only
Any competent entity in null has scouts and eyes..a delay would help weed out those getting away with murder and treating some sov systems like a safer hisec…at least force them to pay more attention and learn.
"I’ve been thinking about this for awhile."
You and everyone's mothers-in-law.
eve-search.com is your friend.
Remove local? No quit crying already … Even the DUST players use local now you fruitcake.
Remove you from Eve online? Yes, yes, yes and again … Yes!
I liked the idea posted on here a while back that suggested to add more 0.0 space that has no local and requires the players of eve to scan out and build warp gates and infastructure. As long as it was motivational isk wise people would explore it.
Making the current 0.0 void of local would put the nail in the coffin for nullsec.
However, improving D-Scan is an exellent idea. Also, pinging on scans would add a much needed boat/submarine feeling to the game….Althought I still want destroyers with depth charges for those cloaky campers.
i like this idea. I would like to further add, ship signature. its a feature already in game for guns, probes etc.
Since space ships in Eve do act as in water, your line of thought would tie in nicely.
Go crawl back into the wormhole whence you came with your terrible ideas on local in lowsec/0.0
Sounds like a solution in search of a problem. 0.0 is not WH space.
Go play EVE Online some, and i'm sure you'll figure out which problem this is addressing.
"I just jumped into system X, local is at 40, enemy fleet is in here." ~1 second after jumping in.
"Hey guys, local +1, his name is ____, he's in corp ____, definitely their scout." ~right-click show-info
"Woah woah, local spike, everyone warp off." -Approx. 1 second
"Yeah mate, it's perfectly safe, if you see someone join local just warp off and cloak."
"Oh yeah, local is filling up, way too many dictors on scan at the gate, safe-up and wait it out."
"We can probably take this, local is about 150… oh wait local spike to 220, yeah too many __ship_type_x__ let's get out before they land."
Most "fights" now are just a battle of escalations. To see who has more escalation available, and the quality of that escalation. A single scout, need only best-speed through some known systems and the moment he sees local he can identify the location, affiliation, and composition of the enemy fleet in moments. Assuming you don't just have a scout logged-off in that particular system waiting. It's a fucking game of trying to hide/mask your cyno-alt and not let them find your fleet sitting on the titan. And when you finally jump-in, even if not on-grid, they see the spike and warp off. It's either a gank or the enemy realizing that you brought reinforcements in and now match their numbers, and because they're too pussy, the moment they see this they can warp right off. They don't have to notice more ships hitting grid, or feel the direction of the fight. It helps blur the line between good and bad FCs.
Removing local effects both sides, offensive and defensive(whichever way you'd prefer to describe it) equally. It makes individuals and groups more difficult to find. It makes roaming individuals and fleets more difficult to see coming. In fact, it helps out the underdog trying to start up in space of their own, because they are more difficult to detect. It means you would actually be required to find out where they were to discover what their name, corporation, or alliance is. Though they won't know that you've found them.
A RF timer is still a RF timer and there can still be a fight. It's just easier to hide what your fleet comp is and where you're going to strike from. And that goes for both sides.
It becomes easier to catch ratters because they won't see you hit local. And it makes it more difficult to catch ratters because you have to find them.
Having said all that, perhaps I'm not all-for removing local entirely. Someone made a comment with the idea of having a constellation chat be local (not bad, interesting idea). Simply removing ~some~ of the intel provided by local may be the best bet. Remove the counter for the number of pilots in system? Keep their names, show-info, etc.. just don't show a numerical count of how many are there. You'd be able to "eye-ball" it which could provide enough intel for small groups, and enough inaccuracy for larger fights. Standings icons, pilot names/info.. all have potential.
Your drunken comments made the point I was attempting to make 10x better than my sober comments. Phooey.
f…. no!
Eve exists from 2003 (it is almost 10 years now) WITH this LOCAL and live more 10 years with LOCAL.
Without local 0.0 will be a complete mess.
Poetic Stanziel should shove his ideas up his arse. Eve is already pretty complicated game for people, thats why not many new people coming in. Why to do something more complicated?
Not true , the game is just boring in some parts , like the dinosaurs 10 years ago , lucky we find ways to kill them all ;D
Not true , game in not complicated , 10 years from know there are going to be so much ppl that your not even going to fine you self in local ;D
Beeing able to solo/small scale pvp is already very hard, due to ppl using blobs. If the local goes off, nobody will be hanging around by himself. They will all be so afraid….Also what a stupid idea, scanning giving names etc
Yes, let's increase the turnover in Nullsec to that of Wormholes… What a retarded idea to get rid of an integral part of EVE that's been there for 10 years. You don't want local? Go live in a Wormhole genius….
Let sov holders decide if they want their local in their space to behave as per highsec or as per wormhole space
true , my finder hurts to much after one hour of spamming , need some kind of auto switch ;D
I know where u are even if u don't show i local ,ill find the system you be in , ill proudly find u, and know one will ever know u where there in the first place ;D ,nnaa ,, there will be some ways to have some kind of filter system for your corp ,etc
heyy bro , i dont think there nothing more worse than Rebecca Black Songs ;Even if you try to strangle a kitten
Since this is a SciFi Game, how about all that nice stuff….
- Launching Satelites which informs us about fleet movement
- Minefields at Gates
- Automatic scanning of the senory suite.
Eve is not Counterstrike. A common Eve Spaceship has less electronic brain than an modern day warship.
Removing local is a lame excuse for deeper problems to generate fights. For surprise strikes, better cloaky ships, easier bridging then titans, but… best would be reasons to fight.