EVE University graduate. Drama Llama. Covert operations pilot. Poetic Stanziel has been very active in the blogging community bringing views from seasoned high-sec pilots, we please to share his stories and views on current Eve Online events and invite you to read more stories from his Poetic Discourse blog.
Poetic Discourse: Own What You Can Afford
All sorts of rumours about Test Alliance. That they can’t make their sovereignty bills. That Pandemic Legion loaned them 100B ISK. That they’re now renting out their space.
Then there was this tweet today:
@ktouborg TEST is now renting space out. Fix nullsec, or renters (instead of one’s own pilots) are the future of nullsec income.
Whatever happened to the old credo: “CCP can change what they want, but players will always adapt.”
I just see a lot of complaining. Not a whole lot of adapting. Or at least, not a lot of willing adaptation.
Granted, I’m not particularly knowledgeable about nullsec finances or politics, so feel free to clue me in. I’m just coming at this from the outside looking in. Wondering, what the big deal is all about.
From what I understand, current technetium prices are at about the same levels as they were 18 months ago. Everyone seemed to be doing fine then. Sure sure, Test Alliance now owns thrice what it once did, but if the rumours are true, they can’t afford it. They wouldn’t have been able to afford it 18 months ago, either. So other than the intervening 18 months of unfettered OTEC bliss, not much has changed.
Has OTEC, and the price increases it successfully manipulated, has that caused a mass loss of sense and reason?
Why does Test have to resort to renters? Why can they not simply adapt the Goonswarm model? From what I understand, Goonswarm doesn’t rent space to its allies (Razor, Space Monkeys, Fatal Ascension, etc.) It simply gives it to them for being good, capable and reliable allies. If they aren’t reliable, Goonswarm kicks them the hell out of the space and gives it to someone willing to be reliable. Goonswarm ends up with an amount of space it can manage and afford, and in turn is rewarded with a good number of large and faithful allies.
Based on the influence map, I see Test trying to hold three large regions (Fountain, Delve and Querious), while having given Period Basis to their allies, Tribal Band. Why not give Querious to their new buddies, Raiden? Or, maybe it’s about time Honey Badger partner, Pandemic Legion, started pulling it’s weight in sovereignty and took some piece (if not all) of Delve.
Even if that’s not possible or realistic, what really is the big deal with renting?
At the end of the day, there’s been a change to EVE Online (i.e, the re-introduction of alchemy). It’s shaken a few things up. OTEC made some people very rich. Everyone knew that wasn’t going to last forever. And it hasn’t. While OTEC lasted, overly-optimistic expansion occurred. But things change. After every boom comes a recession. Booms are not indefinite. What could be afforded, can no longer be afforded.
Keep over-extending, refusing to adapt, refusing to admit to the reality of the situation, and the necessity for contraction will turn into a forced catastrophic collapse.
Feel free to clue me in on the reality, if I’m way off base.
Why do they need to rent out their space when they have 9000 members that could be using it.
They put the hate on "carebears", but now they need them because they are too nub to know how to do it themselves.
No hater alliance is going to succeed at renting.
It's a good point. What do the legions of TESTies do for income? Where are they when they're not blobbing? They have been funding the SRF with moon goo, which was fine when they lived in a small space without large sov bills or logistics problems. They could give their members drakes and maelstroms, which they then proceeded to blow up stupidly, knowing another free ship was just waiting in the corp hangar, having no concept WHERE these ships came from, or HOW much work it would take to earn one yourself. As TESTies skill up and fly larger and more expensive ships, this will be more of a problem. Rifters turn into Drakes turn into Maels turn into Tengus, but you can buy 1000 rifters for the cost of one T3.
What do TEST pilots do for income? They run incursions in hisec (badly
)
Ratting is so 2010
Judging from our mumble and jabber, we are either working RL jobs or playing minecraft, BF3, or DOTA2 when we're not blobbing.
Test is filled to the gills with new, low skilled players – While it's heathy to attract a certain number of newer players to your alliance these players tend to be high Maintenance and exert a drag on a an alliance's resources. They don't create significant income or support the existing infrastructure of the alliance like older players tend to do. So while these guys are great to pack fleets with rifters, the cost associated with these "conscripts" is condierably higher than older, more self sufficient players.
Renting space makes a fuck ton of isk what you should be asking is why they didn't rent sooner?
They did not rent out sooner because it went against their whole "We are bros, and bros do not make other bros pay rent" mentality. Test always went off about how they have so many allies because they were not considered renters but their bros and that renters do not join in for fleet fights only bros do. It looks like "bros" are not enough to play bills tho and they are having to resort to what the rest of null sec without tech does. Gotta love Test eating their own words hahahhaha….
If you had listened to Test's SOTA you would know that they decided they didn't have a problem with renters but the landlord's. Furthermore Test is at war with Eastasia and has always been at war with Eastasia.
Are you a parrot?
Ignorance is strength.
It's called young dumb leaders who lead with there head between there legs instead of the head on there sholders. CCP needs to do nothing. Its easy to take space. Its easy to blob the other guy. But then after its done, then what? People blue ball you cause no likes being steamrolled. Now cry like the rest of the young people in our world today saying its the Goverments/CCP fault cause you didn't prepare or think.
I hope CCP sticks to there guns and not change a thing. Rember CCP invested – Made – and Maintains this game we call EVE. They given us tools to do as we please within reason. We may not like it sometimes but like all we must Adapt – Overcome – Or just go crying like a bitch. Welcome to SOV Bills TEST . Welcome to reality TEST. Welcome to EVE TEST.
Right.
Because all of 0.0 falling into the hands of CFC and CFC's pet coalition HBC is what CCP wants.
What he means is that if Test/HBC wants to keep their space they will have to pay for it.
If they cant pay for it they will just lose it and return to how they were before the fall of nulli. etc etc.
Also if you think about it, with how things are now and people-alliance hating hbc and cfc if they actually manage to conquer all 0.0 they will lose it because they wont have renters/allies/pets (pick one) and we will once again start fighting over the empty space.
The current sov bill system is set up to favor more smaller alliances per region then one large one. With many small alliances holding 1/4 of the systems each, the sov bills stay manageable.
In time TEST/HBC will understand this and crumble/split up into smaller groups. Creating a more diverse 0.0. Although i suspect them all to stay blue to each other anyway.
What is different from NCDOT, -A-, and Solar and their renting, I don't see the difference, an article I just read in here says that Test has regained their financial footing. Don't all big alliances rent except for Goons?
Goons rents, theres even costs alot more, you fight and die for them, they bring 10% of the fleet makeup and then take 95% the moons and systems giving there pets breadcrumbs and having them say thank you.
Shit it would be easier and less embarrassing to rent with ISK.
You don't see the difference. Test has stated they want to continue to SCAM. -A- say what you want about them. They are not SCAMMERS in this area. If I was looking to rent why would I even consider to give isk to someone and move assests into Null sec of CFC-HBC. When they have stated and done nothing to be trusted in this area.
Seems like they should have worked something out with TJA
They did.
TJA has had 280 corps run through that alliance in the short time it has been in existence test and TJA deserve each other.
They did – raiden and init join and on day one they get gobs of good space. after weeks of fighting for Test, TJA got to STFU and take it shawshank style.
TEST are just following the economic models used by our own governments, spend more then you have, and borrow the shortfall.
Actually they are closer to the German model between 1936 -1945. Government subsidized economy, heavy doses of propaganda culminating in a rapid military expansion well past their ability to support it economically.
Null sec doesnt need fixing. If the sov bill is too huge, thats only to prevent a big abomination of an alliance that test is. It's grown too much and too fast for its footing.
Renters arent the future.. renters have always been the big income. Its called rentabilization of space. Besides… even with the numbers test have, i doubt they use their to a big extent. They will of course concentrate on the best ones.
Classic example of the boy who had more eyes than stomach. Toughen up kid and stop bitching!
Sov should Cost according to moons and rats in it. Umi should cost 5 Bll a month just to own, Since in reality thats only 1 Tec moon, but taxing a Ihub in Provi and Tribute/Dek/Branch/Venal is just ridiculous. Risk vs reward once more only applies when CCP wants it to.
Then drop the space
How would you then measure key strategic systems that are -0.01 with shit moons in sov costs?
The best way is a plain measure across the board. Tying it to the resources of the system will only nerf the quality of the best ones. – generally speaking i must add.
thats imho.
The risk-reward is still there. Think your space in Providence is too expensive? Then leave, and fight for better space. Or go live in high sec.
Null sec has a king of the hill aspect to it. If you don't like your shitty little coal hill, go fight for the one with the gold mine in it. And if you cant be bothered to do that then get off your hill someone else will gladly take it.
There can still be a king of the hill, Im not saying that but Kings pay way way more to run countries than a farmer to use his land.
Tec moons number one need to get spread out perfectly evenly, this would make some pockets in each Constellation worth fighting for and would be king of the hill but not have 1 group have 12 Tec moons within 1 Titan Bridge and 5 Regions wide not have 1 Tec moon, Sorry thats not what the model is supposed to look like, there is supposed to be war in all places.
Take the USA, We need Timber, Steel, Coal, Hydro eletric power, solar etc are they all in one place? Hell no
To tax Wyoming who raise sheep and have the population of a few million the sam as taxing california that makes enough food for the entire country each year and has 60 million people should not cost the same to own or run.
And number 2, if you did divide the US, the Coal is in the Mid-South-East in basically 3 states, the Timber is in the pacific northwest mainly, and the Steel is in various places, if the made Tec only be 1 of the very popular moons the way the map is now it would make sense, essentially Goons would own all the COAL or Oil, But until its divided among all r64 moons so each race uses mainly 1 moon type to make its T2 Ships this way is broken.
Make moons like Tec make T2 Cald ships since it there regions mainly, Delve would be Amarr ships and divide 4-8 others in there corners accordingly and make each corner worth something…..Thats not to hard to grasp and it would stir things up and be interesting not like watching the US debt clock rise and rise for days on end.
Actually i disagree Sov and income should come from the bottom up.
* with that said the Corps should own the sov (easily fixed with increased cost of holding sov / number of system held)
* a corp should want to be in an alliance to keep its holding safe
that way once your commited to a Alliance and your fond of your space your more willing to defend it.
giveing alliances more tools to "Tax" there member corps like a option to demand
say 100 B in total and the taxation depends on your size and your participation in fleets.
Why is everyone acting like TEST is going to collapse under their own weight? Yes, right now they're walking the edge of a cliff and if someone pushed them hard enough, they could be pushed right over that cliff. The problem is, no one can push them that hard.
Even if someone could push them that hard, TEST does something very few other alliances do, they motivate their members with something other then the aggressive destruction of their enemies. This means that if someone did push them into dire financial straights, their member base would likely prop them up financially at least in the short term. So they would have to be pushed even harder.
That aside, TEST is walking this line right now because they have to. None of their allies/pets/whatever the name is, have the logistical capacity to roll out at the speed TEST moved into Delve/Querious with. They had to dump their warchest and take the risk. This sprint has given their allies time to catch up and start moving sov structures into position to transfer over. In the next few weeks you will see new little beacons of alliances popping up in the previously massive block that is TEST space as the new allies finally begin to catch up with their coalition partner.
IDK why PL picked them TBH, but PL is propping them up, without PL Test could never have beat RA or NS. And for PL to team up with Montolio is just lol.
Montolio is a tool who really sounds like an uber nerd, I know its Pixel spaceships but he sounds like a WOW player, so does Zagdul and the other lot….Just seems like the biggest sounding tools in the game shouldnt be running things, they talk like they have closepins over there nose and where fanny packs.
But with 0 cost to having a blob that will always happen….Nerds unite. They recruit newbs off of reddit smart but nerdy newbs
Until the Blob is looked at as a weapon itself and is taxed just like a Frigate is smaller and less power full than a Titan therefore it costs that much less, the blob will ruin/always control Eve, PL I guess is adapting, but losing there "Elite" status and respect. And Now Testies have PL to aspire to….Used to be PL`s trainig corp was Goonwaffe now its all Test
The reason PL picked them? Because they're the only ones that pay PL, well, that and GSF. PL isn't the power house they used to be. You could see that when it was just them v Nulli. It was fairly even battles for every engagement, maybe PL pulling ahead slightly in the long run. In order to win, they brought in TEST, who were right there and could easily provide meatshield numbers. I'm pretty sure this is just PL ratcheting down from "King Maker" down to sycophant….
Its sad but i agree, I think my old Broskis are dwindling, maybe not as much in Skil las number, I think alot just moved on to WOT ARMA and other games and once SC`s got nerfed they lost more log ins.
So they needed a large group to help them get those 200 man fleets they used to get and buff them with a 3-400 man kitchen sink no talent meat shield.
Shadoo is a great FC and Elise I will always love, but they could have teamed up with NCDOT and while they stil would have not had the numbers we together would have had enough supers to beat Northen Coalition version 2 AKA GSF/CFC. Sorry but its true GSF just inherited NC mk 2and even pacafied the tough guys like Raiden Evoke and many more who could have fucked them up…You got to respect there polotical might, they sure dont have a great military but make peeps think they are number 1 lol
While I know it will never happen culturally, I always thought the combination of PL and -A- would be unique. While PL's numbers are smaller these days they still have an ungodly ability to theory craft and have a deep pool of good FC's. Say what you want about -A- , but they can field large numbers of competent high SP pilots that have been constantly warring and can adapt quickly to changes in fleet composition. That mix is a potent blend. Add to the it a nonchalant attitude to sov, a healthy number of titans and SC's, and a culture based upon PEW.
so on paper it's a scary combination, but I don't think it could ever happen – too much history.
I just wonder what did you hear from Montolio or Zagdul that made them sound as WOW players ?
anything specific pls ? And even if they are, they are somebody in EVE (not WOW) and who the fuck are you dude? Departed by Test from you huge 500 mil assets in delve 123-noobship-kills pvp hero?
Nothing is forever, same works for Test, but at least they play with joy and get their fun!
Ive never fought Test you retard, I was Cry Havoc/Pl then NCDOT. Also been around since 05ish so 500 mil I could lose for a month before it would break me…But besides all the chest beating I have heard Zagdul talk and Montolio as I have had spies in both Allis for a while and they both know Eve Pvp as well as a newb WOW player.
And to say they are famous? Famous for what? Being Goon pets? Wow big achievement.
I want CCP to start charging for Blues just like the wardeccing, pay per number of blues.
Imagine TEST and GSF`s bills then GSF would owe say 100k per blue [Can use JB`s and other services like stations etc] then after each thousand blues it gets expotential after 1k blues it goes 1 mil per blue per month then another 2 thousand =2 mil per month per member to use JB`s an stations etc…
There would be no way to share JB`s for 45k members like these blobs do and make each pet make there own networks of JB`s and use there own stations and sure they could somehow not try to shoot eachother in battles but there still would be alot more confusion, this would make guys like FA/FCON/LAWN etc either join Goons and give up the "Im Zagdul im independant of them we are just buddies" to Either we join them or pay huge amounts for JB ntworks and have sov not as 1 blob but as a highway like area, this means that a smaller force could attack 1 system and break an allies JB network, not like now where its all owned by Goons/Test and all pets use them whenever.
The Blob is 10k more powerful than Titans and Titans cost 90 bil….So why is the blob free? Hell why can you make money off it?
There needs to be risk vs reward I thought, well joining Test now has prett much 0 risk and tons of reward same with GSF…..They need to pay for this huge advantage of players and not just have a "Arms race" of who can recruit the news fastest. That is a broken model.
Long ago in the age of BoB and beyond that in history, blues did not exist in game. However blues in the ally sense still existed. Blue icons are nothing and in old EVE's era people could blob without them. They just looked at the alliance ticker before shooting things.
I was there I remember but, what it would do now is limit people to station and JB access…In other words it would be a huge fee to have tons of people use your stations and JB`s who wernt in your alli.
That means FA has to own sov close to tribute in order to fight in trbute not just stay at a goons station…And GSF takes and holds all of the stations and systems so far even though FA/FCON etc has done more work.
It would be so much harder to have a huge blob co-ordinate if you couldnt all stay in 1 system and use same JB`s
In otherwords Goons to pay for there 45k man back up in this fight would have to pay for it or give away systems, as it sits they make there renter/pets fight or they boot em. And they keep all the space.
Also remember the olddays when there wernt blues like you were talking about… a 300 vs 300 was a huge battle with very little over 1k in a system ever, its easy to over come a 300 man Drake fleet, with our 90-130 guys, its not easy to over come 500 Drakes 100 Maels and 50 Caps…..It should cost them for using numbers as a weapon just like it costs us more for a Titan than a Frigate as a weapon….Its logic
It really is time to get rid of the blob warefare, so that we can all have more fun.
EvE should be about diversity, about using all the different ship types, about proud alliance identities. Not about alliances that are such a big large mess that no one could be proud to be in it. Not about grouping together as many of 1 hip type as you can, that has no imagination, uses no skill and out blob everyone else. Not about suppers or capitals hardly ever engaging each other because the risk of escalation is so huge. Common CCP make it more fun for everyone and you will get more new players.
It is logic? From what retarded view is that logical? Using numbers as a weapon does cost if you die and loose ships, it costs for fuel, for sov… But you propose there should be a "fee" for those Alliances/Coalitions that actually get enough people to do this?
What is your stand actually? "oh look at me, i am so small and have no friends.. It is wrong that those bigger than me can do things i cant" ? Is it the little-brother syndrome running through your head?
CFC and HBC have accomplished something.. they are not big because they have kidnapped 45k people.. they are big because people have joined them out of free will.
Your logic is so flawed its not even funny….I can come in 80-100 1.5 Bil ISK ships and you can blob me with 600 Drakes and I can never win unless you make a massive mistake, So by your logic risking more numbers of ships is risking more losing them?
Your saying the side wih the most powerful tools [including numbers] are risking as much as the guys who have 80 men….Thats non sense.
And if you did have 600 60 mil Drakes and Killed my 80 man 1.5 bil isk ships and lost half your army making my KB 3:1 you would still win the ISK game big time.
Its way more scary using a smaller flee of elite ships then a blob of new ships who anyone can replace and insurance covers 65% of lol
You really deserve a darwin award for this.
I get whysome others may disagree but your reasoning is retarded….Obviously the side with a huge leg up and massive advantage to begin with is the most vulnerable because they have more ship to lose???
Numbers is most powerful thing in game, W made Corps to be tight knit groups of like mindedness think of the mas countries, we made Alli`s to group corps/countries and Attack/Defend/Regulate certain areas you know like Nato or the UN, Multi countriy forces.
That wasnt enbough for you guys so you made up coalitions….Lol So either all go under the Alliance of the "Honey Badger Alliance" or pay to play as 30 different groups banding together, the reason everyone doesnt want this is greed, far to many CEO`s/Directors make far to much ISK this way.
If you made it so PL was one Corp [which it essentilly is now adays the same as Allies were in 05] Then you would have to get what? 20 Corps leaders and elect 4-6 Directors out of that?
How about GSF lol 155 Corps Converging to 1 Corp instead of alli and having all these "Bosses now have to ratt and grind like thee peasants, while only the top .01% take in the moon Goo money like it does now….Nope thats why it wont happen and people fight just like real life…..Money, and just like RL Germany and Italy didnt become 1 entity with greece with the EU and now they have to carry all the dead weight of those bad choices, where as your coalitions have 0 downsides.
You have simply made the game who ever has the most guys wins…..Thats terrible and not what Eve was founded on since I have been playing in 05 and not founded on the isk vs reward.
There has to be a point where small groups can control space, otherwise its very boring. So we look to other games like WOT MWO BF3 ARMA etc until CCP changes things then we come back.
So just like RL you cant use my super secret bunker with all my nuclear missile control, just like in Eve where you are either a citizen with power within that Allince/Corp or you cant use that Jump Bridge/Station/Cloning Vat ship services etc.
Blob warfare has been becoming a problem for to long but now it really is choking Eve to Death IMO.
Come in 1.5b ship? When have you even undocked in something worth more than 150m? HBC fields Napocs for fun.. where is your counter-fleet? Oh i know… they are sitting in stations shivering with tears of shame running down the sides.
I still fail to see the problem you have here.. this is not happy ponies in space, this is EVE! A sandbox, a harse enviropment. EVE is not fair, it will never be fair, it should NOT be fair. Since you fail to grasp that simple fact you will always sit in your tree whining like a little bitch.
What you could do however is getting allies, be nice to other entities within the game who could help you get equal numbers. But nooo… you are so elite, so pro that you can treat anyone as second-class to you. How is that working out for you now? Didnt want those blues anyways?
But i guess you will never understand this will you..?
The problem with being an "Elite" is admitting you need help is it not? But sure… whine on about numbers, the unfair advantage HBC/CFC have because they worked for, and achieved, something great. Something bigger and more dangerous than you.__Next time we pass your stations ill be sure to wave at you, standing crying in your CQ, from my Napoc. :*_
Jumping on the bandwagon is rarely risk-free. Whether it's a ponzi, a bubble, or a scam, everyone jumping on-board thinks they will get out before the bills come due. And everyone but a small handful are wrong, because there is always risk, ESPECIALLY when you believe there is none.
Don't worry about the big BLUE
Test and Goons will hide under there Friend Zoned Coalition… until they implode.
Goons 9k… Test almost 10k … Keep it up!
All this players will some day want to actually play there own game, rather then some Utopia.
If only CCP were listening.
Bntyhunter for CSM , great idea
i second this statement……
a fleet should cost isk? lol
umadbro?
Did I say a fleet? Hell you being in Test having 9k members would have such a major advantage, are you scared Bluing PL would break the bank? Can you stand on your own?
I fly with Goons /Test / PL and i think this would be a great idea. It would re-vitalize the game. Its far too stagnent at the moment.
Poëzie, I recommend that you listen to the hbc state of the coalition broadcast, they mentioned why and how they do it and why goons don't have too. Anyway i don't have a problem with the test approach as l8.ng as they treat them well. Personalyithink they will for as far as I've met testicles (LOL autocorrect on my tablet) they have a good attitude.
Yeah well if you listen to it you might see it will be very hard for them to get renters. They have said they want to continue to SCAM for renters and try and get real renters. Well this is going to be difficult at best. No one trusts you. (CFC HBC)
251 systems (81 of them with outposts). 251 – 81 = 170. (without outposts)
170 x (6 mil x 30 days) = 30.6 bil isk for systems without outposts. (maybe more if some of them they have Jump Bridges upgrades)
81 x 546 mil (IF those station systems are fully upgraded) thats 44.2 bil isk.
30.6 + 44.2 = 74.8 bil isk (ok, some systems may be fully upgraded, some just have one or two, so lets round this up to 90-100 bil isk per month).
Now, this is easily affordable if you rent 20 good SS systems to 20 corporations/alliances and each of them will pay you 5 bil/month.
Only problem is to find those 20 clients …
Especially when you have such a fucking crap reputation as GSF and TEST have in scamming their renters and clients.
You know your comment could be seen as bitterness, but, you have a staggeringly good point, i cant imagine many corps that could facilitate 5bn a month in rental fees and still be new enough not to distrust any promise or agreement made with goons & co (co being test).
Maybe its around the time that all the betrayals of goon & co bite them back in their arse.
That and the fact that you have pvp power houses living right next door. Say what you will about -A-, but they remain in the top 3 on eve-kill consistently, usually holding the number 1 spot for months at a time. Who would want to rent space in querious, or delve for that matter, when you are getting constantly roamed by -A- and friends? Not to mention to constant cloaky faggotry that is HUN.Reloaded (keep it up btw).
:killboardsaregreenelitepvp:
However well they're doing otherwise, goons are still goons.
Only a fool will trust them with money and jump freighters coming in fat as ducks.
Goons have a much greater amount of tech than test, and test owns more space
Just saying this could all be solved listening to the SOTA and looking at the influence maps – http://dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Verite/influen…
(Razor, Space Monkeys, Fatal Ascension, etc.) It simply gives it to them for being good, capable and reliable allies
This is where I stopped reading
From a point of view they are.
They give numbers to the fights, they pay the bills (I dont know about tech moons) and since I dont think they dont have strong bonds with each other they are easy to replace if any of them are not "good pets"
No wonder your alliance has no Tech.
Test owns the 2nd highest isk porducing moon in the game. Neo. Which is number 2 to Tech, and the big concentration of Neo is in Delve, and Querious and Peroid Basis. There should be no excuse for them to be "having sov" problems with that many moons.
https://evedreams.wordpress.com/2012/07/25/the-re…
This shows a good reason for Test's invasion of the south west.
If you haven;t realized this yet, Neo brings, at most, one tenth of the price tech does afaik.
renters dont like afk cloakers……everybody jump in a covert ops and head out to test rening space
win win win
I literally laughed out loud when I heard of TEST doing this whole renter thing. There is a certain comical element to TEST basically being Goons little ones, but now with a whole load of -A- and other renter alliances thrown in!
I laughed some more when heard Mintolio's justification. I mean, when Mittens needs to come up with after-the-fact justifications, they at least sound plausible, though you know it's just good smelling shit thrown on top of bad smelling shit to make all that shit still somewhat palatable.
Son, I don't think you understand how slumlording works, and how it destroys things from the inside. You are in for a rude awakening. And its ok – it's a bit of a travesty that you guys have all that space gifted by Goons to you anyway.
Don't laught too long or loud – it's probable you may find yourself in fleets flying for test. Look at your new "friends" and then look at their friends. Vince has stated that he considers NCDOT a loose part of HBC and test along with PL bros.
100billion for sov bills let put this into perspective 9000 members thats 11mil per member ffs 1 days ratting by those 9000 pilots at 100% tax for a day would pay the sov bills for months.
Ratting in rifters is really hard….
And Test has started transferring sov to other alliances, shit just takes time
TEST and GSF`s bills then GSF would owe say 100k per blue [Can use JB`s and other services like stations etc] then after each thousand blues it gets expotential after 1k blues it goes 1 mil per blue per month then another 2 thousand =2 mil per month per member to use JB`s an stations etc…
hmm
I smell a lot more 'change of opinion' like this in the near future.
You spent months convincing people about your CULTURE, about the fact you are so great, revolutionary, brosef with your allies and so on. Part of your propaganda was focused on telling everyone how renting is tyranny; in the end you are becoming what you hate.
Now your leadership tries to justify all this shit turning over 'in fact all this is coherent with our culture'. Grow balls and tell people that simply it didn't work and that you have to adapt or you will die.
Funny is how you try to convince people that you will never become a 'landlord'; in fact you don't have experience in this aspect of EvE, for now you don't have to deal with many renters and their problems, how can you be so sure about what you will and what you will not do in the future? Your strong CULTURE, your anti-renting ideals have fallen in so little time, are you sure you are able to speak about firm decisions?
Be careful TEST, people may ignore your alliance, for sure they will not ignore the reputation you are gaining.
butt hurt best hurt
Truth hurts, for along time they made fun of renting, now they just evicted a "Renter" because a BS reason about them whining when in reality they needed more space to rent and to give Raid and Init in exchange for fighting AAA
m8, I understand your position but is this really the best thing you have to say?
Let's suppose I'm butt-hurted, mostly of the things I wrote down are direct quoting of TEST leadership, or are you asserting that:
1. TEST never shit-talked about renting
2. TEST never made propaganda against renting
3. TEST never encouraged renters to "break their chains"
etc..etc..?
I joined -A- and was aware that:
- they have pour diplomacy
- they care about kb-stats
- they are hated by 80% of EvE
- they will be hated more and more in the future
- etc, etc..
Speaking about you (supposing you are a TEST member), are you sure your alliance respects and maintains the ideals they where pouring you? I know what the (EvE)future holds for me, can you say the same?
ehr..
http://i.imgur.com/9Qfyq.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/Lrrd3.png
Test is at war with Eastasia and has always been at war with Eastasia.
1. TEST's moon mining operations do currently cover their sov and reimbursement.
2. Putting all your eggs in one basket is a really bad plan, so looking into alternative sources of income is prudent.
3. TEST do give space to their allies for free, check Querious on Dotlan if you're not convinced.
4. The TEST renting plans are to offer another option. If you want ot bear and not be asked to fleet up for strategic ops, here, rent this space. If you want to be an ally and join the fleets instead? have some space to live in without renting.
5. expect more of Querious to end up in HBC ally hands, but flipping sov on entire constellations in the middle of what is still a war zone is something that requires a certain amount of care and organisation.
Cultural Weakness – TEST has made it a point to differentiate itself from Against All Authorities. A primary cornerstone of this differentiation – Renters. The rental system has been portrayed by TEST as a "master slave" management style . TEST has repeatedly stated that renting is one of the primary things that make -A- "evil". TEST now find themselves facing serious financial realities and will likely need to rent space – becoming the same "slumlords" they so rabidly rallied against. As the TEST model aligns closer and closer to -A-'s income model, it becomes increasingly difficult to rally the troops on these "pseudo-moral" grounds. Complicating the "we're all equal Bros" mantra… several alliances that sided with TEST in the early stages of the war have since been gutted, leaders cast aside and much of their membership absorbed into TEST entities. This seems to have served as a mechanism to bring on higher skilled players within TEST. Simply put, TEST are too quick to rationalize their many departures from stated "cultural" cornerstones.
In time TEST/HBC will understand this and crumble/split up into smaller groups. Creating a more diverse 0.0. Although i suspect them all to stay blue to each other anyway.
Blob fests killed Eve
"If they aren’t sycophantic, Goonswarm kicks them the hell out of the space and gives it to someone willing to be submissive. Goonswarm ends up with an amount of space it can manage and afford, and in turn is rewarded with a good number of large, bootlicking pets, who are completely useless without direction from goons."
Fixed that for you.