Seraphim’s Corner – On Current Null-Sec Wars and Realities

By Dark Angel | Aug 31st 2012 6:56AM
186 Comments

riverini’s note: I took what I felt was a theory-crafting article and turned it into a overview piece of the two null-sec conflicts going on right now. You can read the original here.

Dark Angel is a old EVE player; having spent time in Null-Sec, Empire, Providence and some times in Wormholes his knowledge of EVE crap is endless, and mostly useless.  Complaints can be filed in the round filing bin on the left, but if you really want to bother him feel free to email.  DarkAngelPrime [at] gmail dot com

Seraphim’s Corner – On current Null-Sec Wars and Realities

From the outside looking in, there is a problem that has been brewing for nullsec residents… not to mention all of EVE.

We have a situation brewing where one group of pilots might very well be able to take over all worthwhile space in New Eden.

Two allies, the Deklein Coalition (a.k.a. the C.F.C.) and the self proclaimed independent PL/TEST SubSet (a.k.a. H.B.C.), centered around Goonswarm and Pandemic Legion / TEST respectively. Each count with an overwhelming amount of numbers by themselves which then are added up to their large standings list. Put all together they represent a fighting force of well beyond 35,000 pilots and alts.

Their main hegemony contenders are the three coalitions led by Against ALL Authorities, NCdot and SOLAR FLEET.  While not allied directly with one another, they are certainly on the same side of the fence at this point. By either necessity or sheer arrogance all these entities pride themselves in fighting outnumbered, tending to rely on better tactics, more expensive ships and fittings and kiting enemy fleets to win the day.  However that advantage can be turned quickly as the DekCo have been adapting with better fleet comps and their ever growing numbers to hold the field.

So lets take a quick tour of the current battle zones, like the old Northern Coalition before them, the DekCo is fighting several wars on different fronts, which is a good thing when you happen to control half null-sec sov – given than the otherwise ensuing stagnation would force CCP Game’s hand into action, putting a hit into what is +35,000 of their loyal customer base.

The North

In the North you have GoonSwarm Federation leading the pack, on the offensive vs NCDOT and their limited allies.  A war centered around the now devaluing Tech Moon economy,  the DekCo can outnumber the NCDOT friends in almost every time zone, however that at least ensures a good fight for the DOT Brothers – called this way given their knack for putting a dot (.) at the end of their alliances. They have been fighting an uphill defense, specially in recent days where loses has been heavier, as shown by this this past Sunday’s event in which they lost 30+ capitals without support and betting on the DekCo response time – a bet which they ultimatedly lost.

EVE KILL BATTLE SUMMARY

DOG NET BR

The South

Against All Authorities is the only active entity with space left in the South at this moment. Their current enemies are the self proclaimed Independent Democratic Republic of the Honey Badgers – seen by many outside their sphere of influence as a necessity rather than a consequence. Since it is plausible to claim that null-sec has long turned an “US vs THEM” situation, one which is directly tied to the overwhelming numbers the nodes are capable to handle in this post-TiDi world of ours.

As shown by Delve IV (or V depending on who you ask) – there is one i-Win button CCP Games haven’t been arsed into fixing; like pre-nerf super-capitals and tracking titans before them, the blob makes any engagement a one side affair. DekCo strategist are well aware of this and decided to split forces.

The much discussed schism from within the Deklein Coalition haven’t stopped many from pointing the obvious pandering and the fact that it is Pandemic Legion who leads the Pack while TEST Alliance gets credit billing since they bring most of the pilots and both keep their blue standings toward the GoonSwarm Federation and their allies.

Pandemic Legion is an interesting husk to stare at, with the days of dropping titans/super-capitals and claiming the field well behind them, they seemed hopeless in this recent “numbers-win-the-war” reality of Eve Online, the only way to keep up was to “team up” with TEST’s numbers (which are pretty much second to GoonSwarm Federation’s) and play the “new” game. Which yielded interesting results since taming the TEST beast hasn’t been easy for Pandemic Legion – but an Alpha dog knows how to impose their authority into the pack and good number of good fights has claimed to their favor.

The russian lead Against All Authorities is at this moment in weak spot with a good majority of their numbers at the end leg of the holiday season, this hasn’t avoided -A- and allies to make an attempt and put a decent fight until the holidays are over, roughly in a couple weeks from now.

While PL/TEST shifted from the offensive to the defensive in the South, Goons have recently shifted from the defensive to offensive.  Both sides seemed to have reached a point of sluggishness and predictability. Both conflicts have, for the most part, been static wars, but both PL/TEST and GSF seem to be “winning” the structure phase of the conflicts. Using their broad time zone coverage to prevent the loss of anything important, structure wise, with the threat of the trump card that is PL’s super capital fleet in the South to keep fights, for the most part, subcaps where Pandemic Legion and TEST Alliance holds the important numbers advantage. GoonSwarm Federation have been able to use their time zone coverage to their advantage as well, albeit – unexpectedly – showing a weaker US Time zone, Still pressure has been on DOT Brothers side. UMI-KK being successfully contested by the DekCo is a good example of this.

Even if -A- were to stop attacking Delve, the fighting would likely continue.  However, it is unlikely that TEST has any desire to hold -A-’s space, other than to deny -A- that space, which is a weak reason to pay sov bills in an alliance already on the edge financially. Though, TEST seems to be opening up to the idea of having renters or pets hold space simply to deny the space to enemies, so it isn’t completely out of the question for TEST to eventually switch to the offensive again in the future.

In summary

It takes a quick look into the Sov Map to get a bleak feeling out of the mid term null-sec prospect. Two very focused conflicts do not warrant a healthy overall prognosis of Eve Online null sec.

In the north the GoonSwarm Federation and allies can afford the luxury of losing battles to DOT Brothers and still hold the field due to their overwhelming numbers. Something which had happened more often than the DOT Brothers would care to admit. In the South a serious push for Against All Authorities sovereign has been all but attempted by Pandemic Legion and TEST Alliance who seem more concerned into taking the training wheels off their grunts and setting up a good amount of buffer alliances between them and their home systems.

What about SOLAR FLEET?

SOLAR FLEET is the wild card in this game, a 1,600 entity whose feeder alliance, SOLAR CITIZENS is in fact the third largest entity in game. There has been a lot said about how SOLAR FLEET will come to bring the good fights and numbers to any of the non-DekCo entities. Something which comes mostly as a pipe dream since the only efforts one can attest from this entity in recent history is helping the odd B-class alliance with hotdrops and securing Geminate given than NCDOT is quite busy up north. So don’t get your hopes up with SOLAR FLEET coming to the rescue or changing the panorama, specially since NCDOT and SOLAR FLEET share a rocky past.

Closing Comments

Should the Deklein Coalition wish to, there is nothing stopping them from simply banding up and taking most of the sov map, apart from their self imposed moderation and this is reality which will remain at least until next year. That’s it, of course, unless apathy kicks in for any of their members.

For the ones on the receiving end – DOT Bros and -A- all is left is to sit back and enjoy the rough ride, since even wild possibility of banding together would result in a defeat once the numbers card is played. The blob as an i-Win device is something which CCP Games and the CSM should look into deeply before the problem gets out of hand – doing this while keeping the sandbox essence of EVE Online is indeed a daunting task. On the other hand, if having large amount of players blued up and banding together was CCP’s solution to their perennial “drive people out of high-sec” dilema, then don’t expect changes any time soon™.

- DK

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  • Ncdot Grunt

    Whatever slim possibility that existed of Solar allying with NCdot against CFC up north ended a day ago when BL tacked and killed a Solar Fleet Nyx.

    Not that it was ever a likely possibility anyway. I wish. Solar was able to fight nearly evenly vs NCdot/Evoke back when we were fighting them in Geminate, adding them onto our group up north would help secure our EU TZ into being as strong as the Goons in EU, if not stronger.

    And US has been fairly even recently when fleets have remained under 700 or so on goons side, aside from when CFC calls all hands fleets and shows up with 1000+.

    • foo

      Dude, the reason why Solar won't come for NC. is because NC. is choosing there friends only by the current situation and never stand for someone in the long term. That's exactly the opposit of what a russian alliance like Solar does. They choose their allies once and stick with it. NC. behavior from their point is disgraceful and NC. a nice enemy to fight but one of the worst allies.

      • bystander

        life sucks, the allied had to ally themselves with Stalin during WW2 to win the war. Stop being a baby, fact is, if CFC wins and HBC wins, you're next!

        If you help and beat CFC, do you really think NC. will take your space? lol

        stop being a baby and start working together

        • AlllBlueeeee

          Rather lose space and sov, then blue nc.dot.

          Morality is all we got. Greedy fucks.

          • wut

            you should understand now that nc. is for goodfights. after this war ends we prolly reset 90% and start pewing. Isnt this what the game is ?

          • Anonymouse

            Nope, Eve is Freedom to do whatever you like.

          • Northerner

            Soon, morality will be all that's left of you…enjoy it?

          • Anonymouse

            'And the meek shall inherit the earth?'

        • Guy

          Yeah, that's right, we should listen to a guy making World War 2 references who hasn't actually been involved in the conflict.

          foo is right. They were perfectly happy to do a sov war against solar+allies when it was quiet. Then suddenly Ncdot started asking for drone region help, and promised that they'd sort out the moons and money 'after the cfc was defeated', instead of offering something immediately.

          • anonymous

            Go listen to our SOTA if you think that we have been the ones begging Solar to come help. We didn't think they would then and we don't think they would now. Yes we would have liked it and when Gypsy volunteered to fight on our side we thought that Solar might come too but in the end we started this war and win or lose we've had fun fighting the hoard.

      • AlllBlueeeee

        Spot on, we are Blue with Solar, due the best fights with them before the DRF steam roll.
        Great foes, and glad we are blue, and I hope that we do not get involved and team up with NC.dot crew.

        Our block has had opportunities to join, but why? greedy dot tech fucks.
        NC.dot and Co could have easily let slip a few tech and offered some love way before Tribute burning, but to god damn greedy, with no political/diplo magic, so no a chance of bro-mance.

        No tech for us, and hopefully no tech for them.

        • Truth

          You talking about greedy and your in solar? nc. are no where as greedy as you, for example you were the ones that instead of helpin SoCo you thought you could take nc. Tech, for a power. Block that says gfs in local you make the most retarded excuses, there is infants that would say man upto you. Obviously just a scrub because you have. I grip on reality.

          • Dekco fag

            Ncdot only has that tech b/c they dogpiled on xdeath, and RA's side when everyone thought that war was over, Solar has always considered gem thier space, and Ncdot leadership knew this as well as anyone.

      • Reality Check

        Sometimes you need to put your differences to the side for a while and unite on one front. This is that time – If the CFC are allowed to beat DOTBros and take Tribute, there is literally nothing in game that can stop them. This IS the last line of defence. Ask yourselves who's next/Left?

        If alliances don't rally to Dotbros aid now the only nullsec left non dekco will be NPC regions, and nobody including CCP can see that as good for the game.

      • Northerner

        But blueing people for eternity is exactly what created the behemoth of the CFC. That only results in you blobbing, in you running out of enemies, in you first becoming carebears, then decadent, then lazy and inactive.

        And that sucks. That's not what deliberately smaller entities like NC., BL or Ev0ke or (once upon a time) PL want to stand for. PVP-Alliances need fights and they respect alliances that choose to fight.

        That's why SOLAR's Geminate-campaign was so great for them – equal fights between respectful enemies. And CFC is a common foe to all of them – it's in SOLAR's own interest, to stop them before they're in hotdrop distance to their own moons.
        Oh and that Nyx was just a sloppy mistake, everybody would've killed that guy.

        • Anonymouse

          Ever heard of business cycles? The moment they become lazy and inactive, someone who isn't will come to take their place…

      • Time2growup

        Not being flexible is a big as weakness as any out there, by being wrongly stubborn it's only going to do solar an injustice, would only benefit in a stable climate, in the current climate. Ring stubborn and not flexible will not Benifit solar or anybody else free of CFCs evil clutches. Got a choice use your head or use your heart. If you still confused, this is a time when you should be using your head. This is a climate were using your heart will not. Enifit you in the long run, and certainly isn't benifiting free alliances.

  • nice article

    Nice article, but I disagree with closing comments. It is up to the players to defeat the cfc and hbc alliances. That way, when the day comes, the victories shall be even sweeter. Even if the whole map belongs to them, we will just have to rebel and create civil wars or something.

    So no, please do not have CCP "look into it" except for possibly one reason, to make 0.0 more fun and attractive and worth while to visit pushing more players in EVE to wanna move there, or at least die trying.

    • Asheren

      The main problem is resouces not numbers. CCP by accident or design created enviroment where its possible to avoid deah penalty normaly associated with pvp. In any open world pvp that means numbers superiority. Death penalty is a balancing factor bewen skill and numbers. CCP needs to find a way to make alliances poorer without touching players wallets too much. I would start by increasing sov bill prices, adding extra quite significant charge to sov bill for station system.(i would even go as far as allow players to do one time station dismantle before puting that change)

      • Trolls > Goblins

        The problem isn't the faucet as much as the sink.

        You are right about recources, (balance factor-) sliders and (death-) penalties though.

        People fly Drakes because Drakes are "free". When ships are free it's easy to amass numbers of casual players. The problem is much less Tech making people rich, as Tech I losses not making people poor. Meaningless PvP feed numbers and make fighting them pointless.

        Almost any trend since the post-AoE stagnation in 2010 (ie., when the trends enabled by the AoE change began conforming to the doctrines of today) have been about risk-aversity and deterrent gameplay. Supers in numbers is a well-known example, not enough of them die. Why? Because they are mainly a deterrent in numbers. Drakes are mentioned. What about BS? Hellcats came about because they dealt with both Drakes and AHACs on a cheaper replacement bill than AHACs. Highlight the last bit, after "on a cheaper". PL stopped using AHAC and began using BS because of that. Nothing else. AHAC tactics were not really "countered" by some smart FC in 2010, people just realized that 50m is cheaper than 150m, and you could lose 3 Hellcat fleets for every AHAC fleet. Performance wise BS just became appealing again, and as one BS began to profile so did others – and here we are back in pre-AoE sniper BS days – with a design team looking to limit Drakes by the principles of 2007.

        That's really all there is to it: meaningless losses – numbers – deterrent – replacement.

        That Tech has been too valuable definately have it's own place in discussion, but it's not really what has been feeding blobs. The only real problem with Tech is that it's POS-based and POS are hitpoint-based, so Tech (or any other mineral) is safe from small-gang incursion.

        Small-gang groups really have no problem "fighting blobs", their style of gameplay however revolved entirely around making dents by killing ships. In today's environment they have no (meaningful) targets, that's why they pack up and join PL :) .

      • Master Sgt MacRobert

        The Key changes needed are an increased number of isk sinks at the top end of the game:
        1. SuperCaps/Titans can project their power too far too easily without much cost. Make them more expensive.
        2. Titan Bridges are not expensive enough and should be shorter range.

        Sov Bills are already expensive and discourage small 0.0 entities – they do not need to go up

        Remedy by increasing the fuel cost per jump of Supers or Titan Bridge. Make it so that their fuel bays can only carry sufficient fuel for circa 2.5 max range jumps and with an increase (double or triple) in cost they'll have to bring logistics (a JF each) with them (and a huge stash of fuel) to make a 5 region relocation.

        By shrinking the ability for Superpowers to project the range of their blob you catalyse localised fighting and create zonal defensive patterns and then you might see some fights that have 4-5 Supers only.

        In RL if you want to go to war on the other side of the globe it will cost you all of your time and money getting them their and you wont be able to deploy home again at a whim.

    • Random Miner

      I don't see how CCp could ever do anything about blobs. You can't limit the number of players in system, limit alliance sizes, stop people from wanting to join blob alliances because people want to win, or really make having more people in a fleet be prohibitive. The way titans use to have more power was the only real way to combat blobs, because it made it possible to have only a handful of ships with the ability to take out many others. However, even that was iffy, because dekco probably had just as many titans, but not really for pvp purposes.

      So I don't really see CCp even TRYING to think about blobs until one coalition controls literally all of null, because then pvp would degenerate to RvB type gameplay

      • Its happening now

        And realistically that point is only a matter of months away if CFC continue as they are at the moment

      • Trolls > Goblins

        1. Small gang targets (targets not based on hitpoint pools that enable numbers and capitals).
        2. Cumber in losses (ship costs; the largest problem today is that ship losses have no meaning).
        3. Political cumber in number (standings have no limitation but also let you to clear overviews etc).
        4. Mechanical cumber in number (spool-ups, time-based mass-restrictions etc).

        Et voila, le fixed.

        • Jason B

          Also, blue should not be able to use their allies jump bridges, or titan bridges. As it is now, it's simply too easy to fly from one corn of the NAPfest to the other, and makes power projection a really good reason to blue up everyone around you.

          CCP should be trying to make it appealing to fight your neighbours, not blue them, and should make it more of a pain in the ass to help your allies if they are four regions away. As it is now, having a 2nd, or 3rd front in a war is not relevant, b/c the blob can chain titan bridge different 15 alliances anywhere in less then 20 mins.

          My biggest problem with the NAPfest that is Dekco is that it's a standing coalition, if these dudes actually had fights with each other, and only blued up when they were threatened, or when someone broke agreements like OTEC I wouldn't care, but the fact that these dude want to hold hands, and sing kumbaya makes null sec a very static, and predictable.

        • Random Miner

          i didn't mean can't as in they couldn't possibly change game mechanics. I meant can't because they want people to flood to alliances like these, and any restrictions will stop that. And can't, because no matter what people will find a way to get everyone there. Any strange restrictions you list, mst of which i don't understand, will decrease the player base, because it's too big of a change

    • Some Guy

      Yeah but Mittens effectively had CCP "look into it" for the titan nerf. Then Raiden. gets invaded just after.

      Meta game much?

    • Dekco fag

      Nice idea of "it's up to the player to defeat dekco". Problem is numbers are on dekco's side. Dekco is playing eve on easy mode, dropping the I-win blob whenever they need to, and saying stupid shit like….."good fight guys" as if they had any chance of losing versus an enemy 1/5th thier size. Or that tidi fights are in anyway fun, or entertaining for anyone involed.

      On top of all of that retardation I just mentioned….. we have retards like yourself running around the forums implying that it's possiable to consistently beat a blob four or five times your size in the current eve sov. mechanics in an effort to try and keep the easy mode/I-win gameplay he or she enjoys.

      • Lube

        sweat tears of butthurt… No Tribute for you!

  • WTF

    Props for a pretty good and unbiased summary. Although the involved may find nothing new. Good nonetheless.

    • R0ot

      Can you pass me some of what you are smoking when you read this as unbiased?
      All this has happened before and will happen again.

      • Really?

        When 'before' has 60% on null been blue to each other?

  • grunt

    one sided and empty article, repeating again and again the whining of riverini…
    CFC is what it is because have better organization. Instead of focusing to find out SoCo / NC. mistakes author is whining again.

    SoCo has beed there for many years now and was in stagnation during all that time. Could not expand beyond it is original Stain base and that is it. Why? Dont explain it with tech, it has nothing to do with it. Goons were expelled from delve and started from scratch with no tech as well.

    Same with NC. – have been in Tribute for more than an year and could not expand beyond their own core base. Why? Because of bad management – just look at their renters(wtf?) TMA and ROLN – both are pure carebares. Was it right for NC. to fight on both CFC and Solar in Geminate at the same time? Is this a good management? So cold 'Elite' alliance are nothing more than arrogant and short sided self loving egocentrics.

    The reason why CFC wins are better organization, active alliance managemnt, best reimbursements, innovative player base (OTEC, hulkgedeon, hi sec manipulation etc.) all of which benefits its members. Not even to mention best FCs in the game…

    • (.)

      Hahaha, u just got in goons like few month ago, right.
      Oh, sweet times….

    • NPC grunt

      "Dont explain it with tech"

      "best reimbursements, innovative player base (OTEC, hulkgedeon, hi sec manipulation etc.) all of which benefits its members. Not even to mention best FCs in the game… "

      obvious contradiction, otec and hulkageddon is OBVIOUSLY caused by tech. Why? Cause OTEC is grouping of tech alliances and hulkageddon gets payed with money from tech moons. Hi sec manipulation is caused by the money initially gained by tech. So shut it.

      And for the part of better FC's, let's noteven start about that.

    • Ncdot Grunt

      I really thought you were serious until you said you had the best FC's in the game.

      An alliance like NCdot (which I am a part of) Rarely expands beyond a certain size because the pool of players who prefer to fight against the blob instead of with it, and are capable of flying all the ships we require recruits to be able to, is fairly small. Unless we lower our standards, we cant really expand. We never wanted to be bloated by every person who wandered by, and territorial expansion has never been a goal unless it's for controlling more moongoo.

      As for fighting both Solar and CFC? Took you CFC guys most of a month to take one Tribue system, a week longer than it took you to take over 2 regions in the south, while we were fighting SOLAR at you a the same time.

      Good managment? Our players log on to get in fleet every day in every timezone to shoot stuff. Fighting a war on 2 fronts only means easier availability of pvp when the TZ difference between the CFC and the russians is as great as it is. So taking tech in gem fighting solar, to fund shooting both you and solar? Sounds good to me.

      • grunt

        for 1 month CFC got all tech moons(16 or more?) and 4 systems, one of which with station. That was the strategy from beginning – first tech, systems next. The systems did take a bit long actually, because of the sovereignty mechanics. NC. killed the first TCU in GIH and we had to start from scratch. Now in UMI there are 4 TCUs at the same time :) Try to kill them all :)

        • dotbro

          there was actually 3 tcu's last time when you took GIH, they dont take long to kill if you're able to do it at the right moment.

        • Lube

          UMI is done and packaged with no resistance. See ya on Jita undock

        • Gecko

          Ahm burning down TCU's really doesn't take that long man literally 10 minutes tops with a decent number in fleet and high dps ships

      • minimee

        I must point out that i belive that the "Elitistic" thinking is why CFC and HBC is so big and your so small.
        (Im not part of CFC or HBC) but i can't help to notice that numbers win fights and honestly with the right direction in less then 2 month you should be able to fly and use a Oracle etc with Meta4 guns.
        and less then a week in a rifter.

        I think all bigger alliances should create a newbro corp and try to recruit newer members to fun in nullsec. not only do they get fresh blood in there alliance but they deny CFC/HBC more members.

        but hey thats just me.

        • Ncdot Grunt

          Yes and no, the CFC and NCdot and the like are playing the game in entirely different ways.

          For the CFC, holding space is security, a place to put blues and every scrub they recruit off forums, and a way to make isk. Those friends in turn can be thrown at whatever they need. If your looking for meat to blob over and take systems with, then that's a great way to play the game.

          On the other side, we play the game to shoot people. That means we recruit people who fly just about everything so that when the FC says "We need ____" that half of our online players don't go "whelp, cant fly that, guess I'll log" I have seen our fleet swap from Tengu's to Zealots to Tempests to Drakes to Talos's all with the same people in 5 minutes, cause we all fly what is needed.

          And shooting people is about all we do in nullsec for the most part. Just as an example, I'm in a 150 man corp, and we have one very nice low truesec upgraded system to rat in. Highest I have ever seen it? Military 2. We have all this sov in Tribute, and we don't even know what to do with the 90% of it that's not H-W, a bridge system, or a cyno gen system.

          So CFC looks like they will take over Tribute. Not a huge loss. Everyone seems to forget we were nomadic before Tribute, and most of our membership will happily pick up shop and move after tribute is lost. The tech will be missed, but meh, whatever.

          Maybe invade Providence again, just for the lols and the superkitchensink defense fleets.
          See if we can go from being NRDS redlisted to a special blacklist just for us.

          • Northerner

            I'm with you, mate.

            I hear the HBC has numbers, no skill and fills its space with pets…you too still got shit in KFIE?

          • Lube

            We didnt want Tribute anyways…

          • Peggy from prime

            I'm constantly amazed that the personalities running both NC. and -A- and Solar continue to let their egos override what's best for their mutual alliances. The only beneficiary of the current situation is CFC and HBC.

            A solar/nc./-A- force would Make life a living hell for mittens and Montolio. Y'all don't have to be BFF's just take care of business and go back to shooting each other in the face.

            The TCB coalition. :)

            Rather, it seems each alliance leader is content to allow their respective blobs to pick them off one at a time.

            It's rather shameful.

          • Ncdot Grunt

            Lets see…

            -A-: PvP allaince, has all the pvp they want. Happy.

            NCdot: PvP alliance, has all the pvp we want. Happy

            Solar Fleet: I have no clue, they never post on forums, say anything in local besides GF, and make a mute man look chatty overall.

            So in the end, both NCdot and -A- are getting what they want: fights.

            We just happen to enjoy it regardless of being on the eventual winning or losing side. When we get kicked down, it just means moving somewhere where people are able to be shot. I think we can all agree that NCdot+Co is capable of going and taking over some space on the edge of some HBC C-team alliance to kick for a while.

            TLDR: We like it as it is, stop trying to rally everyone under a single blobflag.

          • Lube

            If they are happy why are the so buttsore? http://www3.picturepush.com/photo/a/8429106/480/m…

          • Ncdot Grunt

            Show me anyone here that might actually be from -A- or Ncdot or BL or Solar complaining, all the whining about CFC/HBC seems to be coming from the other groups that dislike them.

            In Tribute for example we knew we would lose in the end from the day we dropped tracking dreads on a goon fleet to kick off the war. We knew what was going to happen but were fine with it.

            All the whining about "Horrific blobbing skilless noobs" seems to be from other anti-goon alliances sitting on the sidelines butthurt that we are not winning against a coallition 5x the size of us and all our allies.

            We just shoot stuff, and restrict most of our shitposting to k_gu . That site is a cesspit sometimes, recent topics in the North thread include sex on beaches, golden statues of dogshit, and the effectiveness of mass disco abaddons.

          • Lube the noob

            Lube are you the scrub that lines mitanis asshole with lube, seem to have swallowed much shit in your time that it's started spewing out everywhere.

          • dotbros dude

            You are thinking like a goon.
            "What's best" for our alliances is pvp, and lately, things have never been better.

            Thanks for good fights CFC.

          • what?

            Even though I hate goons, and root for anyone that fights them for the good of nullsec…. this statement:

            "most of our membership will happily pick up shop and move after tribute is lost. The tech will be missed, but meh, whatever. "

            Sounds exactly like "We didn't want that space anyways", and yes everyone says "Don't worry our group will stay together despite having no tech" end up splintering anyways.

            AND SOLOR congrats on becoming goon pets

          • Ncdot Grunt

            Since you seem to be missing bits, let me explain.

            Before Tribute, we moved from region to region every few months with regularity.
            Owning a carrier is nearly a requirement to join, so moving is not all that difficult.
            Tribute, Providence, Fountain, Venal, Deklein, plus various few week long roadtrip deployment campaigns, being on the move frequently is not exactly unknown to us.

            We really didn't use our space for ratting or making isk, so on a personal level income is not effected much, we all tend to have alternate methods of making our isk. I for example quadbox macks ice mining while studying (student). 35-30milish an hour does not really seem like much until you realize I'm already stuck in front of my computer a good 8 hours a day. On an alliance level, reimbursement rates of non Logi hulls may drop some, but we still have a large warchest to tide us over.

            TLDR: unlike most alliances, we are used to picking up all our stuff and moving whenever Vince gets a fly up his ass about being too sedentary and picks somewhere else to be.

          • Will

            Do come to Providence, won't you?

      • Not a grunt

        tldr: You guys aren't killing us fast enough

      • Kung Shoe

        There is a big difference between fighting the CFC and fighting the CFC + PL. You of all should know that. PL spies and FCs played a majour role in why delve campaign was so fast.

        • Gecko

          Agreed, and I still think there are more spies.

    • Truth

      LOL Grunts comment was so retarded I chocked on my coffee @ work. Back to Kugu with you scrub.

    • AlllBlueeeee

      Got to agree :( ..

    • wut

      Best fc's ? 2you guys have 2 fc's on the whole CFC, GG.

      (quote)"Same with NC. – have been in Tribute for more than an year and could not expand beyond their own core base. Why? "(/quote)

      Because we don't want space?

      (quote)Was it right for NC. to fight on both CFC and Solar in Geminate at the same time?(/quote)
      we son against solar in geminate. they stood down. and now are poking in the back. nothing we can't manage

      • Trolol

        Solar are being Vultures and being greedy while Every body else is fighting the fight,damn Useless Jews.

    • Akrasjel Lanate

      One sided lol

    • dotbros dude

      Sorry dude, your FCs are mostly terrible. Whilst I agree with many points in your post, that last sentence is pure troll.

      I have flown in quite a few dotbros ops against CFC now, and there are three reasons we win:
      1. Goon FCs do incredibly, unbelievably, stupid things (like cynoing 180 maelstroms into a system occupied by AHAC fleet…wtf??)
      2. Dotbros scouts are awesome
      3. Elo is elite FC (honestly can't say the same for NCdot FCs)

      In the absense of some sort of miracle, NCdot are going to lose tribute-we all know that. Many of you guys (CFC) are playing the game with a different mindset: you think you are going to 'win' the game by taking all the sov, or all the tech, or whatever. Most of us in the 'dotbros' coalition are playing the game for the enjoyment of combat. We are opposed to CFC taking Tribute, not because we feel we are 'losing the game', but because we feel it might be our last chance to stop null sec from being dominated by one coalition.

      Seriously dude, what are you going to do when null sec sov is all blue?

    • Observer

      No wonder you are only a grunt, such a small mind.

  • I lost count

    Maybe the east should stand as one and get over this "Elite" mentality they have going.

    Make a buffer alliance to keep your board "green" and have banzai waves of noobs to throw at CFC/HBC.

    Because you standards are so high, and you nit pick the crap outta people they dont wanna join you….then you get dry raped like -A- in delve.

    Complain about blob this and blob that but the BLOB WINS OVER SKILL MOST OF THE TIME! The Americans didn't complain when Japan, N. Korea/China and Vietnamese used the human wave "blob" they just kept shooting hoping for victory and changed tactics to compensate.

    • Bob's capsule

      im not sure whether your a troll or if you've just lost your grip on reality

  • Resender

    Last year it was the Russians that were going to win now it's the goons, I don't believe in the possibility of one coallition winning, they always break up.

    As for Solar not helping, I helped drive NCDOT and friends from Kalevala in july and now we're helping them, when a greater threat emerges enemies and allies band togheter to beat it

  • Ogopogo

    The original article was way better, as well as more readable. Notes: A comma is not a semicolon, and completely shifting the entire point of the entire article is not editing.

    • Trolls > Goblins

      Well put, it makes you wonder why it was not published in it's original form instead.

  • Bittervet

    "Pandemic Legion is an interesting husk to stare at, with the days of dropping titans/super-capitals and claiming the field well behind them"

    "with the threat of the trump card that is PL’s super capital fleet in the South to keep fights, for the most part, subcaps"

    So, which is it ? Is PL the trump card to drop supercaps and claim the field, or not ?

    • Goon since 07

      It still is, but a shallow husk of its former self.

      What he means is; PL used to do this shit solo, not needing the help of 4000+ F1 spamming teenagers.

  • theoneeyedman

    let’s face it the game is boring and turds have a habit of sticking together

    the only way to win at eve is not to play. Web pages like these are more fun than actually paying, unless you’re using the game as a second income or creating a giant virtual pyramid scheme

  • buggrit

    If the game allows you an iwin button, you use it. CCP balanced their sov, supers and tactical combat badly.

    Also, the structure grind – its a mess, an unholy mess.

  • JustMy2Cents

    Thing is, eve is actually a resource game with a focus on pvp. It's very true that the CFC/HBC have a very talented leadership when it comes to people management. It mainly consist of dealing with their members losses to keep them in the fight. As I see it, everything they do keeps an eye out for winning the resource war. They acknowledge that the main resource are their player base, they cover their needs with all the other resources they can get their hands on. This draws more players who want the same making them grow. Increasing the need for maintainance and thus more resources. In turn this conquest for resources also provides the pvp their playerbase needs to prevent stagnation.

    Yet space in eve is finite, thus they can't keep expanding, the trick is that they have to find a balance and the HBC breaking partly away from the CFC is just that; A balancing act to prevent their numbers to grow too big to be able to support. That the war in the north is actually going slow is a blessing.

  • suspect bystander

    yes -a- is the only alliance in the south to hold sov oh wait

  • Black Aces Victor

    Where do you get your intel from?

    SOLARS COALITION:
    Solar Fleet
    Solar Wing/ Citz
    Ethereal Dawn
    Black Core Alliance
    Persona Non Gratis
    The Unthinkables
    Imperial Legion
    BrickSquad
    And Against ALL Anomalies

    So that right there is a 12ish K coalition by its-self

    • AlllBlueeeee

      Yo we all maybe blue to our masters Solar, but each Alliance has it's own standings we have most set as hostile.

      • Black Aces Victor

        Lets re-direct my question to you. Where do you get your intel from?

        Coalition is all blue to each other if you had half a brain you could read a killboard meaning you would see say ED death on SCDOT killboard but there isnt any? because we are all blue as 1 coalition

        Stop wasting our time dumb fuck NCDOT scrub. This is why SOLAR doesnt help the retarded.

        • Tica'Taca

          And if you actually had any intel you would know that The Unthinkables is neutral to SOLAR and has been since the end of the fighting in Geminate. If only talking out your ass was a crime.

          Not everyone who participates in a war is immediately a pet or friend of one side, sometimes they are there for the fights.

    • Trolls > Goblins

      Instead of focusing on how current fights would pan out, you should look at the whole game.

      Political nullsec today is essentially 5 blocks: CFC, HBC, A-TEAM, DotBros and DRF2.

      That alone is a problem within itself: there are only 5 actors on the scene.

      Among those there are plenty of operative ties that create congruence and problems defining between them. CFC + HBC and A-TEAM + DRF2 with a splash of DotBros on the side. You can find sole regions in the game with more political dynamics than that.

      Names and forms of coalitions may have changed to and from over the past 5 years, but it has followed the same pattern of roughly 5 Blocks pieced into 2 sides for 1 concurrent conflict with some groups dabbling back and forth offering tie breakers.

      In essence, "EVE" has been RvB for years. The problem occured in 2007 and was never dealt with.

      That leads us to this article where self proclaimed grunts argue wether the 12k block should fight the 35k block and wether they together with the 6k block could win unless the 35k block also brought in the 15k block at which point everyone would be involved and… well, everybody lose.

      Wake up and smell the coffee.

      • Trolls > Goblins

        I forgot where i was posting so let me spell it out:

        The problem is not enough actors, not enough conflicts, not enough content.

        Goons this, Solar that, NCdot there. Irrelevant.

  • Y R

    riverini rewrote the article because it mentioned CFC without Dekco, he couldn't publish it like that, could he now?

  • nddude

    NC. have allowed new players to join these fleets actually, however the problem is they need ready pilots now and most of the new cant fly the ships required for the fleets, as NC. dont fly Drake fleets! So yes it does stop alot of people shooting. However for this war even those extra numbers wont help that much, its not that many. I have seen a lack of people in NC. fleets to be honest. Not like the good old tri days when you could get 250 people just from Tri in a fleet in like 5 mins. Even from the s called elite corps they have been max 10 people from each NC. corps if that sometimes. Its also been alot of allies, Nulli, TMA, BL, Evoke that have brought decent numbers. NC. havent as a single alliance really been able to to get 100 people from that alliance, so theres something seriously lacking from the so called elitist groups. The ship replacement program is also none exisitant, so going out losing 250 mill ships often is going to stop people shooting. Also with people liek Twinky (who tbh is a great FC) but telling people they are shit and useless on everything fucking fleet, when tbh if it wasnt for those pilots getting in fleet after fleet he would be nothing, so he needs to appreciate what these people do, and again thats actually stopping alot of people joining these fleets, because twink is such a dick to people on comms. In real life he wouldnt speak to people like that cos he would of been beaten up constantly hehe. But i know thats a problem cos i have heard people say they wont fly with him because of it. However we can take on 3x our numbers and win, but when it comes to 900 vs 200 then its a problem thats too much to ask.
    But the fights have been fun. But the problem really is numbers from NC. they just cannot get people in fleets from their own ELITE alliance, its pathetic really. They should completely trim the fat and kick all the useless fucking inactives, or cant be assed players…and get back to being like Tri MK1 used to be… or maybe thats impossible now..

    • dani

      LoL
      Even if I am the only one online/active atm it hasn't stop me from undocking and shooting so far :)
      After all I login to play a Game and have fun :)

  • Observer

    The CFC and the HBC are winning the SoCo and the DOTBros because of blobbing. As anyone who has been on the receiving end of one of the CFC's or HBC's 'blob warfare', they will say that the supercapital nerfs are seriously damaging the game. The reason that the CFC and HBC says that is because it makes their attempts to blob – something that they have pretty much no problem with and specializes at – worthless. So, these guys are pissed, and as these guys make up the majority of 0.0 nullsec and pays CCP plenty of money for registration and subscription, CCP has nerfed the ONLY real weapons that can be used to counter blobs. If things go like this and CCP doesn't do anything about it, I am pretty certain that, sooner or later, the entire 0.0 nullsec area will be eventually taken down by the CFC. No warfare, no anything, just 'Hey, friend!' I am PRETTY sure that this is not the result wanted by thousands of dedicated EVE players.

    PS. I have been recently looking at plenty of EVE resources (DOTLAN, EVENEWS24, EVEKILL), and I believe that if DOTBros, SoCo and SOLAR FLEET all band together to form an Anti-CFC coalition, given the much fairer numbers and the large number of skilled players on this coalition, the CFC will lose, one way or another.

    PSS. Go ahead and dislike this if you want. My opinions will always be the same. And you can't change me.

    • Trolls > Goblins

      You copy-pasted this from another recent article comment here, didn't you?

      Your assessment is still bad :) .

      • Guy

        He's right in the sense that a combined force of dot, solar and soco would beat the cfc.

        But it's not going to happen.

      • Observer

        You got help from someone else's reply to comment here, right?

        Your reply is still awful.

    • dani lizardov

      " because of blobbing" no no no
      Its because of TiDi :)
      Actually it does not help that much

  • nddude

    NC. have allowed new players to join these fleets actually, however the problem is they need ready pilots now and most of the new cant fly the ships required for the fleets, as NC. dont fly Drake fleets! So yes it does stop alot of people shooting. However for this war even those extra numbers wont help that much, its not that many. I have seen a lack of people in NC. fleets to be honest. Not like the good old tri days when you could get 250 people just from Tri in a fleet in like 5 mins. Even from the s called elite corps they have been max 10 people from each NC. corps if that sometimes. Its also been alot of allies, Nulli, TMA, BL, Evoke that have brought decent numbers. NC. havent as a single alliance really been able to to get 100 people from that alliance, so theres something seriously lacking from the so called elitist groups. The ship replacement program is also none exisitant, so going out losing 250 mill ships often is going to stop people shooting. Also with people liek Twinky (who tbh is a great FC) but telling people they are shit and useless on everything fucking fleet, when tbh if it wasnt for those pilots getting in fleet after fleet he would be nothing, so he needs to appreciate what these people do, and again thats actually stopping alot of people joining these fleets, because twink is such a dick to people on comms. In real life he wouldnt speak to people like that cos he would of been beaten up constantly hehe. But i know thats a problem cos i have heard people say they wont fly with him because of it. However we can take on 3x our numbers and win, but when it comes to 900 vs 200 then its a problem thats too much to ask.

    • LOL

      Erm all ships are replaced for NC. including Titans/SCs LOL & NC. have brough upto 170-180 to fleets before now,depending on Time zone. But yes alot of NC. have multiple alts,so realistically NC. has mb 400 highly active players around timezones & maybe another 200-300 AFK and the rest are Super Capital,capital,logistics alts.
      Yes Twink is a dick,but there is people that repeatidly make stupid mistakes,so can't expect FCs not to rage or troll,got to let steam off now an then.
      You get used to Twinkys rage,it is famous. Probably worse than Sort Dragons EVEN lol.

      • lol

        agree with most, but there is no such thing as a good raging mad FC, if an FC needs to nerd rage it means he is a shit FC and need to go on meds and quit eve.

        • anonymous

          Not at all. His raging makes you remember your mistakes and if you have an open mind you learn for next time. Plus his rage is hilarious you just have to not take what someone says personally especially in a game.

      • Sameyaa

        But yes alot of NC. have multiple alts,so realistically NC. has mb 400 highly active players

        confirming that i have 4 alts in my corp and atleast dual box in most fleets

    • wut

      bhahahahahaaha :D

    • grimm

      Let Elo do the fleets and u're gonna see some nrs. ty riverrini for banning my ip guess my opinion wasn't good enough for such a personality like u'rs suck me

  • sour

    i cant even remember how many times i ve heard this….this alliance or that alliance and now goons r going to take all of eve. before that it was the drf and before it was the nc and before it was bob and again goons…pfff

    clearly some peeps will never understand eve

    • Get Real

      Ok so please tell us what happens once CFC take tribute and install XxDeathxX there? Who is left to make even a slight dent in ANY sov Dekco hold.

      Answer: NOBODY

    • Northerner

      Weird, I never read "this or that alliance" – it was always Goons that were to take over all of EVE since, what, the rise of BoB?

  • fail topic

    poor NC. shoulda done more when raiden were holding the field solo thats what happens when a bad strategist hold a title

    • bob

      Basically NC left Raiden to the dogs and then on the pretense of Raiden collapsing were backstabbed by Ank. What goes around comes around.

      NC can burn for all I care.

  • inacceptance

    Same mistaken analysis came from US Government after the Vietnam wars .. Numbers numbers numbers .. and still they LOST a war.

    • Trolls > Goblins

      The difference, of course, being that some shadowy deity did not intervene on a random basis to reinforce the value of numbers by changing the game played. There were no nerfs to tunnel digging or dense djungle foilage (which meant things like agent orange became largely ineffective), nore was the ability to hold the largest cities in the area the definition of winning.

      Current EVE SOV mechanics isn't modern warfare, EVE is standing armies in medieval feudality. That's why we have castles sieges, fiefs and retainers. Though in EVE the castles won't be overrun by less than an army even if they are unmanned :) .

  • Gnz

    "lead by" -> "led by"

  • HeartGoodFights

    Dear Writer,

    I enjoyed your article and found it to be well written. You are correct in some parts of your article, and horribly incorrect in others… IMO.

    Correct: CCP needs to address TIDI quickly, also, CFC, HBC can out blob enemies with ease. Everyone loves the struggle, and fighting, and wars, and the drama that surrounds it.

    Incorrect: CFC + HBC conquering all of eve – It just isn't possible. You forget that we are all greedy SOBs. At some point another entity would identify a weak spot in being part of a major alliance and want to claim themselves as the mother of all Machiavellian plots by turning on their former alliance. Or an entity finds a way to exploit weak points in a super alliance. In either case, everyone is still fighting, which, so long as that is possible, everyone is winning :-)

    I think the best way to look at taking over all of Null Sec is looking at the board game of "Risk" and trying to control Asia. At some point, someone is going to turn on you, or everyone is going to gang up on you. Power politics FTW

    • Asheren

      Its possible the difference is in method. You dont need to use hard power to control null. Its what BOB leaders failed to understand. Conquering whole 0.0 by making a single power block hold whole space is impossible on longer run. What we currently see is attempt to weaken every other entity to a point where its either under some form of control by the GS or weakned to a point where its not able to pose a threat to the GS.

    • A Random Guy

      TiDi enables blobs, its a problem! Because the alternative, where the game was nigh unplayable even in moderately sized engagements (two full opposing fleets) was somehow better?

  • Lugalbandak

    Man i was bored at work , tnx for the nice read.

    I hope that either ccp does somthing about the blob like limited blue list , more expensive sov cost. i like the idea of sov used = low cost , onused sov expensive or something to stop it.

    Other solution: one big eve world war, 2 fronts to kill each other, must be awsome videos.
    i wonder who is gonna win then.

  • thereisnohbc

    please stop pandering to the retards down in Fountain by referring to them as anything but CFC. you can spit on, polish and shine the fuck out of a turd, but it's still a turd.

  • History Read & Do

    Let's make this simples for the few retards here in a account of history. Adolf Mitler (Mitani) takes whole of Europe (north of 0.0) he aims for world domination and his followers are a misled abomination, twisted into false belief,that must be put to a stop. Allied forces (dotbros)(SoCo) unite to put end to this abomination. Starting affectively 2 fronts.Stalin (Solar) a communist party that are not natural allies, usually seen to be hostile between west,join forces for a united goal for all free countries (united goal to benefit EVE as a community) and opens up a 3rd front, wich stretches adolf mitlers forces and defeat is inevitable. Then Europe is set free and prosperity and communities are refreshed & rebuilt. This is affectively what needs to happen ;)

    • max

      dream!

      only this

      • Yay :)

        Dreams are good,its a possibility slim at this point of time,but who knows in the future.CFC will fall one day,fairly easy to do,as military wise they are shit at pvp,just numbers,so if another large enitity had even remotely similar numbers,CFC would not be around for long.
        Its just waiting for arrogant bastards to get there head out of their asses and Unite.

        • Bittervet

          Yay,

          You're missing the why. CFC and Test have numbers because they dont define themselves as elitists, they train and support new pilots and they treat their allies reasonably well.

          Until SoCo get over their issues with being the elite, they'll continue to win battles and lose wars.

  • ROL Grunt

    I would like to make an update to this article.

    First, excellent article. Well written.

    In the last two weeks, Test has been using a new fleet type: Navy Apocs, with triage carriers support.

    While keeping the drakes fleets, wich we can handle easily with our tengus, those factions bs´s have changed the things A LOT. They can do much more damage (even so, tengus can still hold the fire, with a little more caution) but, in the other hand, they´re nearly impossible to kill !

    At the moment the liders are researching some kind of response to this new threat. Fortunally, they don´t appear often. But, when they do, is almost game win for the enemy.

    Good hunt. ROL Grunt

    • Trolls > Goblins

      New and new.

      Napocs is RnK's LR adaption to their Triage concepts (to deal with HML, Maels and BC). It's been around for at least a full year, though of course not at the scale where Test operate or in their hands.

      • Jimney Cricket

        Napocs may have been around, but to harness that power, you need to be in HBC.. fuck the rest.

    • Observer

      Navy Apcos are a win because PL, as any other ship composition, roles them out only when they are certain they can win. This happens because they always wait for hostiles to form and come to their doorstep, so they can jump into the right ships.

      Simple as that :)

      • Trolls > Goblins

        I mostly had a reservation with the notion that the concept would be new and that any strategists would be hard at work finding counters, since it's been around for a good while and counters are readily available :) .

        • Asheren

          Easiest solution would be tracking dreads the problem is that TEST never deploys them without supercap shade, out of docking range etc. Second way is to get enough peoples to alpha such apoc or just overwhelm it with dps both require an numbers advantage only TEST or GS blocks are capable of fielding due to foxcats geting used only after enemy fleet composition is known.(allowing to set hardeners for max ehp) Bombers are not very efficient due to fact that it would require about 4 cordinated waves to kill such apoc thats about 30-40 peoples just in bombers.

    • watching

      navy ravens..

    • War Observer

      Could void bombers work? SoCo has some excellent bomber pilots and commanders and because those carriers rely on spider cap busting they have to stay close together, even more so because -A- tengus use sensor range dampeners so Navy Apocs have to be relatively close to carrier blob to reliably receive reps. So dropping loads of void bombs on that slow blob could reduce both reps and apoc DPS. Of cource tengus first have to clear insta canis but that is not hard as they have practicably no armor.

  • Nc. Grunt

    You don't give the cfc the credit it deserves. People only talk about numbers but it's not just that. It's their infrastructure and logistics that make them the force they are. Die in a battle? Np. There will be hundreds of fit ships on contract ready for you to reship. Vee is the best FC in the game by a country mile and their strategists are simply unrivalled. You also have dbrb, who may not be as talented as vee, is relentless and willing to lead fleets 23/7. Cfc also look after their pilots meaning morale is always high and people are always willing to log in. Im just an nc. Grunt but even I can see its not just about the blob but people just find the whole blob thing as their excuse for not having the infrastructure, nor strategy to defeat it… Hi vince.

    • Mehh

      Vee is shit,he welps fleets with 2to1 odds or higher odds,numbers wise,although alot of that blame is on CFC being terrible at EVE. Hularious how CFC members look at there FC's as gods while majority of EVE looks an laughs,although thats besides the point,how ever shit there FCs are,they could go into a fight with 5to1 odds and still come off ontop with a 1 week old noob FCing,just because of the fact that there is soo many turds to put in the meat grinder.
      True story bro

      • Lube

        Pleaaase pleeaaase pls cry more while enjoying your receiving end

    • Trolol

      Look after Morale,as in lie to them 90% of the time yes. One thing true here is that CFC logistics and Diplomacy is good,apart from that only the blob is a USP to them.

    • anonymous

      Guarantee you are not in nc. if you think Vee is the best FC in Eve

    • Jason B

      Pretending to be in NCdot, and patting yourself on the back…. how cute.

    • BntyHunter

      If you are an NC. Grunt, I am Jenna Haze.

      Vee the best FC in the game……LOLOLOLOL

    • CFC Grunt

      Hey what you said is wrong. I am in the CFC and moral is very low. We are taking sov but i loose a ship almost every fight. Sometimes we get lucky when we get 1000 ppl joining fleets. At that time is the only time i survive because the dot bros dont fight us.

      "Vee is the best FC in the game by a country mile and their strategists are simply unrivalled"

      hey vee is that u? did you mis type the title?

  • EVE Player

    "The blob as an i-Win device is something which CCP Games and the CSM should look into deeply before the problem gets out of hand"

    You know how to counter a blob? Get your own blob. Its not CCP's fault that people would rather be in the CFC alliances than the SoCo or DOTbros. Maybe if the DOTbros and SoCo alliances would get better leadership and not shit on their members, but in turn help their members excel in the game, they would have just as big of a blob as the CFC.

    • EVE Player

      The day that CCP caps the number of people you can bring to a fight is the day EVE starts to slip and die. The entire purpose of EVE is getting an edge over your opponent.

      • NERF the NERF

        Its been slipping and dying for a long time now,helped along by Mitanis stint as CSM,dear god what fail. Nerf the nerf,so we can affectively blob a million special needs monkeys onto em. NERF Zealots as they can kill us,nerf titan,nerf SCs as they are the only way to affectively counter our blob of turds. lol NERF NERF NERF,go fuck,slit your throat and impale yourself with your own mouldy dildo.

  • seriously

    Not a single sentence about the two CFC titans losses and four lines about dreads losses

    Well played.

    • Bittervet

      OK, here's a sentence

      "Despite two Titan losses, and numerous other capitals, CFC are still conquering Tribute."

  • TEST Bro

    Read the original article. MUCH BETTER.

    Riverini added DekCo references, which the original article mentions nothing about. In fact Riverini is the ONLY person who uses DekCo and lumps Goonswarm in with HBC.

    Why? Because Riverini is stuck in the past. I assume one could figure out when the trauma occurred by his terminology.

    • http://www.facebook.com/martin.b.nielsen.5667 Martin Barkaway Nielsen

      Right.. you one and the same, only difference is the names really..
      Test and PL are still pets no fancy Coalition name will change that..
      When test get beeten they call for CFC daddy for help…

  • Tribal Band Grunt

    Well, personally I plan to fight until NCDOT, -A-, ROL, and all of them are given the boot from null sec space altogether. When all that "elite pvp" has nothing to do other than pirate in lowsec or carebear in highsec, then I'll be happy.

    • Trolol

      You should respect your betters scrub,they have ruled 0.0 for the last decade,and although some are arrogant,they are a foce that can as is proven wreck havoc. There no way a scrub of CFC thats been playing for 6 months should be held above a loyal subscriber of years. Back to the turd heep with you. Learn to pvp an then mb you get into a decent alliance.

      • Tribal Band Grunt

        I do respect my betters, but only if they fly for CFC or HBC. Join and get respected (like Pandemic Legion did) or don't and die in a huge blob of CFC/HBC. This is a new era for null-sec!

        • -A- grunt

          So your dream for nullsec is for it to become like the Chinese carebear server where everyone is blue and no pvp happens? I dont think you have completely thought this thru, join the blue blob to get respected? That seems like a good reason for people to not respect you (i.e. you can't stand on your own against the winning odds). Keep riding them training wheels behind your TEST overlords.

          • Anonymouse

            You just made me want to move to China… just to get away from the deathbears for a week…

        • Bless

          You just realistically don't have a clue do you, bless you cute little pink cotton socks. Cuddle upto adolf mitlers cock kiddy winks. He will tell you a story about how his cat painted the mona Lisa, ofc this is true if the almighty said so, grind more structures, he's low on isk recently due to his scrubs losing so much. Not as much tech in his RL wallet as usual, poor Mitty witty :(

          • Ncdot Grunt

            Damn it, you mean that the cat didn't paint the Mona Lisa?

            My life is ruined, that cat was my favorite part about mittens.

        • PL Dude

          I'm in PL and have to admit that you are a total fucking idiot!

      • ExNC/ProudHBCbro

        ROL is the only alliance you should add in that last decade bullshit. NC. is a mixture of ex X-7 in PB residents, and ex NC pilots. -A- is like half of MM, and IT. Blackwater is the only good corp in -A-. I suppose SSI is good too. But that is it. Everyone knows the only 0.0 alliances that remain the same, are Solar and IRC, and PL ofc…

    • War Observer

      Hey dude don't blame them for your incompetence and stupidity. Your alliance, and bunch of other that form goon pets, are composed of inept and undisciplined pilots purely lead by incompetent FC incapable of conceiving working fleet doctrine or logistic to support it. So now you are reduced to F1 monkey pets for Goons and think of that as success when everything you have, from your FC, doctrines, space and even logistics you owe to your masters. You are nothing without them and you have only yourself to blame for this. So don't be jealous of NCDOT, -A-, ROL for achieving something on their own just because likes of you are too dumb to do it too.

    • dotbros dude

      you really think we are going to go pirating in low sec or run highsec missions? Null sec will have unlimited pvp potential once cfc are everywhere.

      Sometimes its better to shut up and let people think you are a moron, than to open your mouth and confirm it.

    • Gunny

      Tribal Band couldn't kick its own ass not let alone NCDOT, -A-, ROL, watch it you may get what you wish for.

  • 3rd party

    For an old player you sure are fucking dumb. I've been playing about 2 years and even I can say that no one is going to take over all of 0.0…not because they dont want to but because NOBODY CAN. Bringing numbers to the field is just as valid as having good tactics. Sorry but I doubt the Germans were screaming "omfg russian blob" in WW2.

    Yeah sucks to be out numbered, deal with it, it's part of war. If you are big, you're strong, if you are small, you're fast. Play to your advantages.

    • Sameyaa

      "Yeah sucks to be out numbered, deal with it, it's part of war."

      Yeah sucks to be out gunned (tracking titans, only counter to the blob), deal with it, it's part of war. But no you cried and cried till ccp nerfed and then you are telling us to deal with your blob and blobing is a good tactic? LOL

      Also, when u blob, u dont just blob anymore… you drop tracking dreads on ahacs and sentry carriers and supers. Even when you already have overwhelming numbers. Are these the "good tactics" you were talking about? were we supposed to "deal with it" as well?

      • CFC

        well, yes actually we do expect you to deal with it. You are at war with us. We have no "low" setting to compensate for your short comings. Shame on us for using all our available resources for war.

        so many tears…so little time

  • http://evemaps.dotlan.net Lalau

    -A- will be erased from EVE.
    Deal with it.

    • Gecko

      Good luck with that

  • Java

    There is no such thing as a fair fight in Eve or in RL. A loser calls it a blob… the winner calls it teamwork.

  • Space troll

    You sir no fucking clue how SOV mechenics work. BOB didn't even conquer all 0.0, and look how much TEST is paying up the whazoo for their sov bills and barly breakin even. Their is NO real benefit in owning all of 0.0 and yet you post fails to mention just one. 2 wors Tinfoil hat!

    • Bittervet

      Space Troll,

      Yes. but Test's back end are fail. If they remanufactured their moon goo correctly, rather than just take payment at wholesale rates, they'd be better than breaking even.

  • NullSecNoob

    And the fall of tribute begins. TY for the upcoming fire sales.

    • Sameyaa

      moved out of tribute weeks ago… what took you soo long

    • Jesus

      Dude like I said last time GTFO.

  • erg

    ah fu** I would like to see the faces of CFC if we all decide the dramalamablob nullsec has become is not longer worth holding Sov and we all move out

    • what?

      They would be pretty happy since it means OTEC will have no competition

  • Mario

    CFC guys I don't know why,
    You fly with Goons and wish to die.
    Its not a lie, we know its true,
    That one day soon you'll lose your Blue.

    You can take the space, and fight for scraps,
    But your POS will be burning on the fraps.
    They have done it once, and more than twice,
    Being a Goon pet seems awefully "nice"

    Perhaps the HBC has got it right,
    by pushing Goonswarm out of sight.
    They might be Bros, thats well and good.
    But they got no goons living in their hood.

    The gud fites!, will shortly dry,
    Then CFC its your turn to cry.
    The Goons will lie and call you friend.
    But they want your space, thats it the end.

    • Observer

      Can't be more direct to the point.

  • DarthNefarius

    CCP’s perennial “drive people out of high-sec” dilema?!?!?! Come on that is a myth thats repeated over & over again by trolls in hopes CCP starts believeing in it

  • unsatisfied reader

    Test has their hand being held by PL, and Goons. What they (test) dont realize is that they are the janitor. Look close at test Kb. patterns emerge, ex, all cap and super kills goons or Pl are the majority on tje battle reports. also look at the very high structure mails, i think you will notice some mentiond parties kind of light. bottom line is pl / goons let them in on cap kilks and other ops, but the're the shit structure removing crew for goons and pl's meat shield. I suppose leadership in test is aware of this cause they sure has hell been on a recruitment drive the last few months. Asking anyone in HS to come join. Pl are exactly what we expect of bitter vets, get in on the good fight only but not going to log in to shoot structures unless there will be a fight.

  • Qwerty4812

    Dude, what counters blobs, nothing. Stalin's philosophy of quantity is a quality of its own. You're acting as if there are counters to blobs using weapons only. The only counter to massnumbers is to negate those numbers effectiveness through the use of terrain and chokepoints, however, firing through a planet doesn't seem to be a problem, unless CCP wants all of us to input firing solutions and we could hit things we weren't aiming for… would be super cool,

    • anonymous

      Line of sight firing would destroy blobs and you would actually have to fly your ship instead of anchoring. I wonder how the servers would handle that though. The calculations required would be immense

      • Bittervet

        I dont wonder how the servers would handle it. I know how they'd handle it.

        Slowly, as they check every object on grid when you fire.

  • NullSecNoob

    Please put on your reality glasses when writing articles about warfare. The fact that the CFC now holds SOV and a Station system is SIGNIFICANT. It does not mean that DOTBROS are not putting up a good fight, but it doesn't mean they are winning. A little honesty and respect please. The CFC is in the process of crushing the remaining resistance in Tribute and I for one hope they put up a good fight. Five systems including the station system in UMI-KK are under CFC control. Since we are in a war over sovereignty you can't honestly look at a map and say "Well DotBros might be winning" because for certain they are not.

    • Sameyaa

      "Winning" for CFC is taking sov/tech even if it means welping the whole fleet

      "Winning" for DOT BROS (Stark Bros) is fighting outnumbered and still winning the actual fight (GFs)

      CFC maybe taking sov but dotbros are doing well in many of the fights.

      • NullSecNoob

        Oh I see how that works. I will try to remember that I am losing as I dock at UMI-KK station. Whoa is me, whoa is me. If we "Lose" much more will have to take Vale.

        • Jason B

          You are truly living up to your name nullsecnoob. Just about ever post I'v ever seen you write make you look like someone that is very ignorant, knows little eve history, and talks about things you seem to know little, to nothing about.

  • NullSecNoob

    There is no "I Win" button, just hard work. To get to this point where the CFC has one station system the cost was staggering. Hard work, teamwork, and good leadership are the "I Win" button in eve. P.S. Big ships alone do not equal victory, NC. and -A- learned this lesson.

  • Chongo

    Wouldn't that be the point? Instead of having a scenario where having the most expensive ships will always give you the win, it is more fair to have the entity with the most people win. Capitals can be bought, and if you have the money (real life or isk) you can get them easy. With people its a matter of motivating them and getting them to fight for your cause. Money should not be the win button, having the charisma to make thousands of people do whatever u want them to do seems more realistic.

  • War Observer

    I think Solar will fight goons and pets but only after they secure Geminite for their allies and themselves. Already there are two allies of Solar that are assisting NC. defence from goon attacks (Gypsy and Intrepid Crossing) but Solar has traditional claim for Geminite and they will not assist NC. directly as long as NC. claims that region. In fact had NC. leaders been less of an arrogant douchebags working with goons in tech cartel and attacking Solar in Geminte to assist Goon invasion of Delve Solar would probably be there helping them directly now.

    Bigest problem is NC. has is myopic, greedy and untrustworthy leadership. To ally with the goons in the first place was stupid, and backstabbing Raiden. and then attacking Solar and IC at Goon behest was just as dumb. But as much I think NC: deserves to be punished for such behaviour I think stopping goon horde is much more important so I hope MACTEP acts quickly and moves his full force against the goons.

    • Jason B

      If Solar did come help, it would only take one OP for supertwinky and his famous overview bug to ruin it all. So don't hold your breath if your thinking Solar will come save the day, NCdot will just shoot themselves in the foot the first chance they get.

    • possibly NCdot

      solar actually started the fights in Gem when they tried taking some NCdot Tech moons. we then had a merry month or so of great fights between 2 fairly even, at least numbers fielded wise, alliances.
      To ally with the goons in the first place was stupid, and backstabbing Raiden. and then attacking Solar and IC at Goon behest
      not really correct on any count, but an almost sliver of reality, enough to fit your narrative maybe. Raiden would have been almost impossible to save. Not with TEST and the GOON/pets/hangers on working together.
      We have actually helped IRC in the past, only a few months ago defend their CSAA's, from GOONS. granted this was more for the fights, and to stick it to GOONS a bit.
      Attacked SOLAR in drone lands when some old leadership decided to help XDeath. Irony there is, now XDeath are near on GOON pets, guessing there hoping to get some Tribute pie in the coming months when the shear numbers win out.

    • Ze BlobBBBB

      Why do we have to repeat this,Solar 1st hit NC. tech,THAT is why NC. defended there tech in Geminate,DEAR FUCKING GOD get this into your thick head,Solar used it as an excuse to fight nc. rather than help soco in delve. Solar could of done a number of useful things,i.e. help soco,or hit cfc tech up north,but no they got greedy an hit NC. tech,obviously NC. was not going to allow them to do this,so a few months of GFs ensued,and NC. took all objectives that was planned for. THIS was NOT to take further tech or space,they don't care about that,it was due to solar trying to take their tech in the 1st place. NOW that you've got that straight in your thick head,mb we will not have to repeat the obvious again & AGAIN. This is besides the point however,Solar as the last free power block of Adolf Mitlers evil crooked hand,has a choice to get blobbed by that heep of turds sooner or later,or to stand & fight while they all got a good chance to kick CFCs teeth in.

    • anonymous

      You really have no idea do you. Solar attacked us in Geminate so we fought back. Not saying we haven't made mistakes but that was not us working for Goons that was Solar trying to avoid having to go to Delve.

      • Drone_Russian

        You attacked their assets in Gem a long before, during the Drone Civil War. They just wanted to get back what they had before the war.

        • Truth

          Again, it was xXdeath & RA massively outnumbered by solar forces & pets, solar forces were absolutely raping xXdeath/RA it wasn't even funny, wasn't even a fight, so xXdeath/RA hire nc. Among others to prop them up for a couple of months. That was in black and white nc.'s involvement there. xXdeath/RA didn't help themselves though as they rarely brought numbers to a fight, mostly it was nc. Saving stupid xXdeath/RA super carriers.

          • Drone_Russian

            >xXdeath & RA massively outnumbered by solar forces & pets
            Wrong. xdeath had a far greater number of pets and allies at the beginning of the war.

            >solar forces were absolutely raping xXdeath/RA it wasn't even funny
            Right. But they fought mainly on their own. Until Xdeath did not hire PL/NCDOT, and RA not entered the war, Solar was neutral with Gypsy Band and AAA.

          • Dekco fag

            I love how being a merc, ans being hired to dogpile onto an enemy you thought was going to die was somekinda justifcation for taking sov. or moons, but them taking those moons means they are baddies, and are helping goons. I really do want goons to lose this war, but NCdots greed, and awful justifcations for being greedy is pretty hard to get over.

  • anan dude

    Hey remember when the Russians were about to take all of sov null sec?

  • Sold

    There is a player behind every ship in combat. Is it right that one player in a super or titan could equal the effort of dozens or even hundreds of other players? Super nerf was needed. They should be big and huge and have lots of firepower and HP. But they shouldn't change the entire game for everybody to such an extent that their mere presence = gg.

    Now that supers are more in-line with intent, the old super powers are crying about how their shiny RMT toys aren't worth as much and don't guarantee victory. Cry moar!

  • noob

    welcome to Providence dots lol

  • the vet

    i don't know why ccp are encouraging mass blob fights, coalitions of alliances,etc, EVE has one major fault, lag, The technology is not available yet to solve the lag problem, so surely ccp should be encouraging smaller fights, discouraging collations, etc, then everyone would enjoy pvp and eve much more