Poetic Discourse: Faction Warfare – Fweddit and Moar Tears to Caldari

By Poetic Stanziel | Aug 18th 2012 12:06AM
30 Comments

EVE University graduate. Drama Llama. Covert operations pilot. Poetic Stanziel has been very active in the blogging community bringing views from seasoned high-sec pilots, we please to share his stories and views on current Eve Online events and invite you to read more stories from his Poetic Discourse blog.

Poetic Discourse: Faction Warfare – Fweddit and Moar Tears to Caldari

Fweddit and Moar Tears

They’re moving to the Caldari militia. Why? They give their reasons, but I’m not sure they make any sense.

According to Pinky Feldman, they’re leaving because, a) they massively outnumber the Minmatar during USTZ most nights, b) they’re tired of shooting the same people over and over again, and c) they can’t do anything meaningful with warzone control (meaning they’re tired of being stuck at T1 control.)

None of that makes any sense to me.

Let’s start with point A. Are there really that many more Gallente pilots than there are Minmatar pilots? Excluding Fweddit from the equation, I was under the impression that the Minmatar have the militia with the largest number of pilots. So, if Fweddit outnumber us Minmatar in USTZ, aren’t they going to outnumber Gallente as well? Do Gallente love to fight while massively outnumbered? I know on some nights, there migth be twenty of us in Huola, and we’d not really bother undocking to fight the fifty or sixty Amarr shouting us down in local.

I’m not so sure Fweddit is going to receive all that different a response from the Gallente (not after the newness and initial appeal of a new enemy wears off, and their shitting up local becomes tired and boring.) Fweddit will start to be blue-balled by the Gallente at some point, nobody undocks when facing three to one odds.

Point B. That will always be the case, especially if you insist on staging out of one system, and don’t roam much further than a two or three systems away. Minmatar do this, certainly, but then I haven’t heard us complaining that we always have to fight Moar Tears and Fweddit every night (on those nights where the numbers are fairly even.) That will be the case for the Amarr as well, whether they base out of Kamela or Ishomilken.

I think the crux of the matter, the real reason for the move, comes down to point C. They say they’ve got too many numbers, that they can’t find fights most nights, because there’s too damned many Amarr. Yet, they also complain that they can’t control the warzone. Am I the only one seeing the disconnect there? The contradiction in complaints? Just last week, they controlled over fifty systems, and pushed quite easily to T4 warzone control. That required a lot of plexing and warzone management. Most of which was done by Nulli Secunda. Now that Nulli have left for Geminate, to maintain control of the warzone, Fweddit and Moar Tears would have to continue, not only with the fighting, but with the menial labour of keeping their systems plexed up. That is simply something they have zero interest in doing.

I try to remain as unbiased as possible when discussing faction warfare issues, especially between the Minmatar and the Amarr. But in this case, the Amarr complaints about not being able to affect warzone control is a whole lot of disingenuous whining. They have the numbers to do just that, the problem is that they have no interest in doing that.

Currently, Fweddit and Moar Tears make up about 75% of the USTZ Amarr militia population. Of the 25% that have an interest in working towards warzone control, the Minmatar easily outnumber them. Which means that the Minmatar control the warzone, mainly because of a lazy 75%.

So, what does a move to the Caldari militia get them? Well, they get a large militia who are quite interested in warzone control, a large number of alliances who do actively plex systems. This means Fweddit and Moar Tears can continue not giving a rat’s ass about warzone control. They get the occasional reward of T4 and T5 warzone control because of the work of others, and can simply concentrate on fighting, without really giving back to the war effort with respect to the menial labour that is required.

Will the Minmatar miss Fweddit and Moar Tears and the fights they brought? Certainly. They’re fun dudes to fight. Will the Amarr miss their lazy-assed cohorts? Not likely. They obviously offered up nothing with respect to the fight for warzone control.

- Poetic Stanziel

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  • DarthNefarius

    It is my understanding that the real problem is that the Winmatar are able to speedtank the PvE 'plexes far far easier then Amarr are able to with ~8 day old frig alts making iteasier to pour the LP into thier systems. Funny how I always hear abou unbalanced Minnie designs by CCP.

    • nallar

      That was fixed.

      They definitely need to change plexes though, as being able to do any plex in a 300,000 ISK frigate with a few day old alt definitely doesn't encourage fighting.

      • xxolve

        Still doesn't change the fact that Amarr Rats use beam lasers that can easily be speed tanked, and the minmatar rats still lob missles. I'm by no means complaining, simply stating that tanking one requires speed and active reps, while the other just requires speed.

        The current mechanics in FW encourage hundreds of bot farmers to orbit butans, mission and do literally ANYTHING but PvP to make an absurd amount of isk with limited input.

        • http://poeticstanziel.blogspot.com/ Poetic Stanziel

          This is true. I had an Amarr alt for a few days, and definitely noticed the difference in speed tanking. I am able to solo plex major installations as a Minnie, with very little taken in the way of damage. I was not able to solo majors with my few day old Amarr alt.

          • https://www.facebook.com/justin.cody.5 Justin Cody

            I can easily speed tank even the hardest minnie plex in a shield tanked crusader with a little pimping of the explosive resist.

            HTFU:

            Also one can do the same thing in a no-gun active tanked cap-stable merlin with some pumped up kin/exp resists.

            adapt

            The problem is still ninja tactics since you are not forced to clear the rats to run the timer.

          • Lolman

            I still belive FW is flawed you should

            A# need to kill the rats before reaping the benefit of the PLEX
            B# when the button is "hit" everyone on grid should split the reward.

            since you have to kill the rats then you can't just speed tank em and ignore them.
            since you have to kill the rats just go afk and orbit button will not work either
            since everyone on grid get reward depending on number on grid.

    • Red

      I created an amarr alt for the push to T4 on the amarr side. I collected 400k LP with a 5 day old gunless merlin alt(reping instead of speed tanking). I could have done the same with a 2 day old Winmatar alt. Plexes are balanced at this point.

  • Peggy from prime

    Test are lazy ….the sky is blue..water is wet news at 11:00

  • Butthurt Stanziel

    It's not only that, but the fact that the geography of the warzone is completely retarded and various minmatar groups like to hide deep in the ass end of metropolis where they can easily deplex any work done by USTZ plexers during their much stronger EUTZ. These are things that poetic had pointed out before but apparently felt the need to overlook in this case as his alliance has become stale, rarely undocking in fleet compositions consisting of anything other than vanilla drakes, thrashers and the ubiquitous stabber fleets. Boring fights are boring.

  • AmarrGrunt

    You are missing the point on WZ control. The problem is that taking and holding the WZ requires a concentrated PVE effort ACROSS ALL TIMEZONES. Amarr have had a numeric advantage, for PVP, in the US prime TZ. That does not translate to a numeric advantage across all time zones, I can't count the number of times I've spent hours in US prime plexing or d-plexing a system only to log back in the next evening to find all my work reversed. Add to that the fact that a numeric advantage in PVP does not equal a numeric advantage in PVE (this is the part where all those gunless frigates come into play), and a geographical imbalance (Metro is a hellish wasteland for Amarr, with no access to highsec, neutral lowsec, stations to repair, with one camped pipe to and from. There is no way to realistically hold the systems to remain above tier 1 for more than brief pushes, which is demoralizing in the face of constant, easy pushes to tier 5 and the space riches they bring. Our recent push to tier 4 put 1.8 billion in my wallet, the result of months of diligent plexing, and a not insignificant amount of space-money. However, compared with the tens of billions a diligent plex or mission runner can earn in the same amount of time while running for minmatar, it is a trifle indeed.
    I am sad to see Fweddit and Tears go, if that is indeed what they will do, but I don't fault them for doing so.

    • http://www.facebook.com/magnus.palm.50 Magnus Palm

      Audarnae (spelling?) and Hek? It's pretty close and I see lots of amarr there.
      Devoid and bleaks aren't less of a hellhole for minmatar.
      Just get a foothold for repairs and dock-ups, as minmatar have had in Lapabi/Huola etc.

      Amarr is just lazy when it comes to WZ control.

  • Budge

    Ttl;dr

    Poetic Stanziel: You guys should just keep getting blobbed by us. The fact that everyone from amarr has put an alt in minmatar FW, and every random dude that wants to try FW has dog-piled on to our side is irreverent.

    • https://www.facebook.com/justin.cody.5 Justin Cody

      you mean irrelevant

  • space chikun

    this.

  • https://www.facebook.com/justin.cody.5 Justin Cody

    Dear OP,

    It makes perfect sense. EU TZ+multi-boxing pve farmers out number the amarr pilots massively. In US TZ it is fairly even and I like calling you primary when I can. Also quit shit posting. Amarr got to tier 4 with nulli's help but even so amarr was the smallest militia…EVEN WITH NULLI.

    You are correct however in that most amarr militia do not want to put in the pve effort to control the warzone. Most of us consider plexing to be a bad mechanic that does not force fights but rather encourages ninja plexing/de-plexing.

    Similarly ihub mechanics are also silly and honestly ought to have a mechanic more like a player owned customs office so you have the opportunity to force a fight for control rather than ninja the ihub in a thrasher fleet when no one is looking.

    But the money making opportunities in amarr militia are few and far between due to lack of interest in the farming oriented mechanics and general disdain for the publord fleets of fail.

    • Trolls > Goblins

      Are you saying you want the i-win blob mechanics of hitpoint grind to substitute the actual grid-flip mechanics of FW, because you are incapable of maintaining an allround presence to combat ships in space as opposed to amassing numbers for an occassional timer? It sounds a great deal like that.

      • https://www.facebook.com/justin.cody.5 Justin Cody

        no, not increased hp grind, simply put a timer on the thing to force an actual fight.

    • http://poeticstanziel.blogspot.com/ Poetic Stanziel

      When you're taking systems, you offensive plex. Since LP farmers do not defensive plex, your argument falls apart.

  • _Bob

    More and more often the bigger FW corps have to seek their PvP elsewhere (like roflstomping Noir. for example) because there is extremely little point in fighting over plexes, or rather chasing gunless frigates.

  • jay

    atleast everyone can see how pathetic these two alliances really are. Seriously how fail do you have to be to fail at FW. Enjoy riding on someone else hard work and effort .

    • morefail

      You mean all the hard work and effort that will see kourmonen (which was retaken primarily through the efforts of those two alliances) fall back to the minnies within a fee days of them leaving? That hard work? Try to be less of a butthurt nobody when posting in the future.

  • Fletch

    I can understand the move.
    The Caldari care alot more about the sov war than Amarr. There is nothing worse than working hard to capture or save systems only to have it all reversed because the majority of your team cant be arsed to play the game they signed up too.

    Im sure the Caldari will welcome the new arrivals and pile up the pressure on the frogs.
    As for the Frogs well they like to consider themselves the l33t pvp crew so im sure they will welcome more targets to shoot at.

  • lugalbandak

    i dunno wy ccp just inplant web & scram to all the fw rats in plexes , prolly some reasen byhind i dont know…

  • John Douche

    "None of that makes any sense to me."

    The article is a piece of rant. Well meant, but not good. When you do not understand the reasoning then ask for a better one. Do not rant after you have spotted the illogical. It means they have given you bull shit. Why then start digging around in it?

  • http://www.facebook.com/Maudib Per-Olof Vidar Andersson

    Maybe cause nulli pulled of tier 4 (after all) in just a couple of weeks and put a dent in morale in many fw corps.

    another aspect is also that lots of amarr fw corps should be really spacerich for a good time now and that effected inflation of amarr rewards for several monhts ahead. Gallente should have better market to sell rewards.

    and FWeddit cant very well admit that Nulli after all effected them being so close associated with TEST and goons so they had to come up with fake reasons to move…

    • http://www.facebook.com/Maudib Per-Olof Vidar Andersson

      *caldari

    • http://reddit.com/r/fweddit Typo

      Fweddit is in no way associated with the goons. We are not part of test although we both spring from people who use the Reddit website. Many of us are blacklisted by Dreddit or just do not like Test or Goonswarm for various reasons.

      The move was to go where the fun was. Fighting the same people every day gets boring. Tea EaelGreyHot likes to fly a dram with a dedicated booster alt. Susan Black likes to fly heavily tanked ships etc. After a couple of months it is a rut.

      Most of Fweddit came to FW for easy and casual PvP. If we can make some ISK to fly better ships and fight in more than a couple of systems then that is what we really want to do.

      Seriously, out of 600+ in corp we do not have many that care what faction we are fighting for. So I say, For The State! For now.

  • droljica

    FFuck those calamaries anyway

    Great job ccptards leading hiltard…at least those that "fixed" vortex shader smthinglilkethisshit

    • PL Pilot

      U R Stoopid. Everything you say is stupid. Evything oyu stand for is stupid. The onl yon Hiltarded is you. the one who makes up new words to describe people they cannot or will not ever be.

      Nice try. Back to WoW with you.

      • droljica

        plastic tears, best tears :)