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Jester’s Trek: Pair of derps
I’ll make this quick.
Later today or tomorrow, I’ll be publishing my monthly “junk drawer” post, in which I list a bunch of stuff that didn’t really rate full blog posts this month for one reason or another. But two of them are related in spirit (if not in content). From time to time, I like to link things that aren’t obviously linked and these two items really felt linked to me even though they deal with completely, utterly different topics.
First is this column from The Mittani about Delve War V, so this will probably serve as my wrap-up post on that topic. Usually, Mittens’s columns over at Ten Ton are quite good and well worth reading but this one is the worst thing he’s written there… pretty much ever. Petty, vindictive, and lacking in even basic substance, it’s dull as dirt. But best of all, it opens with this laughable quote:
More than fifty thousand characters were involved on each side of this conflict, and the combined forces were roughly equal in power. Commentators anticipated a war of attrition that would last for months…
Uhhh… [citation needed]. Usually, Mittens provides a source link for this sort of claim, but it’s not surprising he didn’t this time. Did anyone think that this “war” would be anything other than a two- or three-week exercise in the CFC’s ability to run timers? I know I sure didn’t. And I’m less informed about Delve than just about anyone. Everyone that actually knows anything about that region predicted a quick, brutal stomping.
Even more amusing is that “roughly equal in power” crack. Uh, yeah. OK. If you say so.
“What is surprising is not that the SoCo lost, but the fact that their mistakes were so banal and elementary,” Mittens says. Even an uninformed outside observer like myself can see it’s because they didn’t care. Mittens says this himself in his own article: “[events] made it clear that -A- didn’t care if their allies lost their space.” Way to attempt to insert drama into a situation that had no drama. As I’ve already said, a Great War this was not. Mittens’s attempt to try to make it one is derp #1.
Second one is this dev-blog about the upcoming changes to tutorial missions.
Now I don’t want to go all negative here, but this dev-blog is again lacking in even basic substance. My favorite bit are all the artificial boundaries that were apparently put around this effort. I’ve had a lot of experience with the tutorials lately trying to walk a couple of friends through starting to play EVE. The fact that the team working this a) only gave it a month, and b) because they only gave it a month decided not to do anything much about the missions themselves really does lend a “Er, OK, so why are we doing this then?” atmosphere to the entire affair.
Granted, some of the UI changes that are being made are nice but they don’t really address any of the core issues with the tutorials that I can see. They’ve got a lot of data about when people quit the tutorials but unless I missed it, they have no data about why. Drawing conclusions on what to do with the tutorials without this is not a good idea.
CCP’s looking for feedback on this. I have some. Give ten devs a big stack of Aurum usable in either DUST 514 or EVE. Send them and ten computers to the nearest gaming convention. Offer Aurum in exchange for watching people run through the EVE tutorial. One of the devs sits behind each volunteer, taking notes and answering questions. Where do they stall? Where do they get confused? What questions do they have? And most important, what frustrates them? Bring these notes back to Iceland. Hell, send the devs and the computers to a mall and offer the participants $5 if you have to.
There’s only one mention of play-testers in this entire dev-blog. I get the distinct impression that these play-testers were CCP employees that were already familiar with EVE and just hadn’t run the tutorials in a while. They were guessing what might confuse new players, not knowing it. What’s needed here is a completely fresh set of eyes on this process from someone who’s never played EVE seriously before and I don’t think the devs involved in this effort got that.
Without it, there wasn’t really much point to tweaking the tutorials yet again. It’s just polishing a sneaker. That’s derp #2.
So in honor of this pair of derps, have a Rote Kapelle “derp sheep”:
That was fun. Maybe I’ll start a “Derp of the Month” post around here. 
You got trolled by the Mittani, congrats. You think he isn't aware that F2oy is a conquerable station, and isn't even in delve to boot? Do you really think he wasn't aware of the exact details of the internal relationship between Nulli and -A-?
Whats funny is people in a couple years will see the article and believe it; this is the Mittani joking about how "the winners write the history books".
The mittani article was shit dude. TenTonHammer.com is neither kugu, CAOD or EN24.
EN24 well known for its quality posting obviously
and yet here you are reading and posting away, handing out compliments
Reminds me of all of yours.
NO UR POASTING IS BAD HAHA TAKE THAT SRSGENERALEE
just like your posting ability … shit
thats actually a good sensible explanation if you ask me, i hate goons but a moderate fan of mitten's and that post only made sense in the context of a troll tbh
if it were written by one of the known posters on EN24 whos comment isn't that far from mine here… i would be much more inclined to think that he did in fact believe what he wrote about the delve 'war' there
if not a troll than perhaps propaganda for the little bees or (most likely) he wrote that article as he did as propaganda for eve and ccp (since published on tentonhammer) i have not articulated that well but i hope u see my point.
Heh, a derp of the month. You need a picture of 'Derpy Hooves' instead.
I saw Delve as the first battle of a much longer conflict. The only question left in my mind is what will touch off the rest of it.
My idea for the tutorial missions would never be implemented, but it would be to sequester (cut off) a couple systems from the main ones and have it serve as a training area. Have each system show the basics of living in different areas/securities and the way out is an npc one-way titan bridge to a random 1.0 highsec system of that player's nationality. (IE: Amarr, Yashunen, Kisogo, Alf). At least one of these starter systems should be a full 0.0 system so players can get a feel for pvp. Make civilian ships of various classes that the npcs sell in here and keep isk and high value items out of the equation. Make it all loyalty points maybe. All items gained here have to stay here as well and are taken back by the npc's when you leave. No 'can't train this on trial' skills for sale, just the basics.
There's a lot more to it, but I don't want to exceed the character limit.
DON'T YOU DARE INSULT DERPY HOOVES!!
I agree that this article was not great. Normally his articles are genuinely entertaining. Always hope for next time.
Don't forget guys, you can never lose if you don't try.
The Delve war looked to me as CFC needing something to do, so they sounded the horn of goondor and rode south for the lulz. Nothing more, nothing less. Unfortunately they can't tell half the kids to stay home, so they killed their own fun by bringing too many to the party. Maybe they should amass enough money to hemorrhage a few thousand drakes a week, and just turn nomad and roam the cluster, attacking anything and everything. Then, once they've had their lulz, take back the space they abandoned.
I never did the tutorial, but I hear it sucks, and I doubt CCP is ever going to make it better without some serious non-EVE player feedback.
-Edit- As much as it pains me to say it, CCP should ask a bunch of WoW players to go through the tutorial. If they can get a WoW muppet to stick with the game through their "fixed" tutorial, it's definitely going to be good enough for the rest of humanity.
thats a +1 right there
To me it is pretty obvious that there had been an evolving plan to take sov in delve since the beginning of this year while ~gudfites initiative~ was just empty rhetoric.
Things did probably not quite work out like Montolio expected them to work out (thanks 99%) but taking sov was a goal from the beginning.
First you had a lot of rumors in February about nemesis & nulli possibly invading south Fountain (with help from the godfathers) which eventually turned out to be wrong.
Then Montolio explicitly offered the horn of Goondor to Viking Empire promising "thousands of CFC dudes" to help vikings take space in Delve. When the plan became public Vikings were rest by TEST for not telling the whole story (this is not the strategic plan you are looking for, nope, montiolio was horribly misrepresented by these "niggers" and all the world had to know it – just in case one of the five dudes who might have noticed the post on eveger.de could have taken it seriously).
FORGE subsequently joined forces with the SoCo in name and continued to provide intel to the CFC+HB for which they got their reward after the war.
And finally on the SOTA that kicked off the delve campaign for TEST taking a "constellation or two" was was mentioned by SortDragon as the actual objective of the campaign,
Clearly these plans were evolving (the war in Tenal probably stopped plans to fight nemesis, Viking dude blew the cover on a different plan to take sov in Delve, 99% SBU'ing all the things worked better than anyone could have expected, …) but bring Delve under HB control was on the table all along.
if you look at the moon map, you will see why the CFC went down there. Delve and the other 2 regions down there have the highest concentration of the 2nd highest moon min. Neodicyioum, however you spell that. Currently the CFC holds all of the highest paying moons, Tech and Neo.
That is pretty deep stuff: linking two topics, because they lack in substance. This web 2.0 generation kicks ass. I thought I had found something similar, but it turned out that in fact I had not. All I found is the Jester lacks substance. I guess I have to make something up.
link us to your blog full of substance, facts and non biased opinions.
I said I have to make something up! But when I am done will it be derp, real derp. It will have things in it that make you identify yourself with it. Like when you have experience and can see this in a blog and can say "I know this!" This is how derp it is going to be. It is going to look like real.
I think mittens is wonderful and believe all of it. SOCO out gunned us and out capped us and WE still came through with superior tactics and more importantly team work. We don't need stats to back this up the truth is in the results and thats what we the EVE master race, CFC members expect. You whine to much and your posting is low on a new level. What proof do you have to back up your claims, With out the CFC are bringing order to Null sec and getting rid of the sub alliances one by one. This is done quite simply by superior intellect and our ability to fly and fit ships better than anyone else.
We make the game what it is today with the full support of CCP. I for one am proud of my virtual achievements and can't wait to finish the job we started
EVE master race….
Their leadership keep saying "We need to kill BoB's 123747644323th incarnation" and then they try really hard to sound just like bob did.
Of course, there is always a percentage of troll in their comments.
2/10
@ Dave from FA: wow.. i mean wow.. are you doing drugs? because this is the most stupid comment i have seen so far.. talk about being an idiot.. you really don't know what's going on right? I bet you are from america to right? and you like Foxnews and believe everything they are saying to..
" I bet you are from america to right?"
Obvious bad stereotype is bad.
Meh I live in America and can agree with that statement .. Fox news has poisoned the minds of Most Americans, its really sad, but most people here today will literally believe any nonsense they are told.
shut up fags. fuck america fuck the world and fuck you. stick to eve. no one cares about fox news or america
dude peoples minds are being poisoned with lies all over the world its true in most countries, most of all china,ukraine,russia, syria – thats the first league of manipulation and laughable democracy, perhaps USA is in the second league together with UK and few more european countries…
like L.Cohen says: everybody knows…
Obvious troll is obvious
Man, you didn't just drink the kool-aid you chugged the whole pitcher…
haha yay.. keep believing that sir. I got a bridge i can sell you…
Please Dave remove your head from mittani's arse
"With out the CFC are bringing order to Null sec" Honestly you are one of those people who just listens to others and can't even have their own opinion.
Mate here's some harsh truth, go back to WOW and enjoy Azeroth
Are you -A- troll, or perhaps SETC troll?
"More than fifty thousand characters were involved on each side of this conflict, and the combined forces were roughly equal in power."
Bullshit detector already went off in the first paragraph.
"With the HBC now outnumbered by the deployment of the SoCo, the quest for ‘good fights’ escalated into a full-blown bloc war as the CFC deployed from the northwest to counteract the SoCo’s intervention."
Again. Good fights were told over BY HB, and they were trying to take SOV way before -A- was ever called in.
"When Nulli Secunda had lost all of their space, they announced that they were leaving the SoCo while blaming Against All Authorities for abandoning their allies."
No it was CFC that announced this, obviously. It kinda helps the propaganda effort.
"Despite having a capital fleet to match that of the CFC/HBC, the SoCo refused to risk them to defend Nulli and RA."
The capital matchup between both sides wasn't even close. Try again.
"If Delve 2012 is any indication, the SoCo is lucky that what remains of their bloc lives in space that is so poor that no one deigns to take it from them."
And finally. CFC's original promise (yes it was a promise) was to invade Catch and remove -A-'s sov. Mittani asked SOLAR FLEET to hold Catch. MACTEP replied to Mittani: "Fuck off." This is fact and everyone knows this.
I guess this is what happens when you have a leader on one political side using a game site like Ten Ton Hammer for his own personal agenda, despite the ethics to be factual.
FA are the spear of damocles and we skewered you good
Catch will be ours its just a matter of time
LMAO shit i popped my rig I was laughing so hard.
i would looove to see you try, i would love to see you succeed even more, as far as success goes A will run to npc and wait till u leave
Wondering what hat did mittens wear this time, too thick aluminium perhaps
erm.. what?
You should split it in two articles
im sorry but i fail to see the CFC president speech and a failing tutorial having relevance to each other.
but in your tutorial i think your correct
best thing to do is player testing. but they can do it cheaper just do it in iceland bring in 20 games on site let them run throug the tutorial of EVE and let the answer questions.
as a thanks they get free 2month subscription to EVE or X amout of Arum
Good point, but you can go further. What The Mittani says was interesting a couple months ago. Now nobody cares for what he says unless you are a Goon director. So this was a pretty bad attempt at creating News. Fact is, nobody gives a shit anymore about what The Mittani says.
Secondly, any pilot who is too dumb to get through the tutorials, or any tutorial of any game, can stay the fuck out of EVE. Does Chess come with a tutorial? Does Checkers come with a tutorial? Does Monopoly come with a tutorial? … Arguing to throw around some money that is not yours and doing some Q&A is exactly the kind of attitude that gets nothing done. It means that you do not give a shit and rather avoid the detailed work that is behind the tutorials. And, again, who really needs a fucking tutorial? Jester is a retard of a blogger.
My best guess is that Jester tried to show some friends what EVE is, they thought of him as a retard, because he was ranting throughout the entire tutorials, and when his friends had enough of him and walked away did Jester look for reasons why this happened and rather blames the tutorials, before facing the ultimate, face-melting truth: he is just a dumb kid.
To make the shit spinning worse did he create a link between the two.
TL;DR: Jester is a horrible shit of a blogger.
Chess, Checkers and Monopoly all come with instructions. So yes, they do basically have a tutorial.
Hell no. They come with rules, not with tutorials! Tutorial means to teach you lessons, as in "tutoring" or "teaching". You are basically left alone and have to learn by doing it and by teaching yourself.
No tutorial will ever make EvE easy for you or teach you how to play it or remove the learning curve somehow. EvE's tutorial can at best make your entry into the game entertaining and give you a bit of free stuff. At worst do they suck you in and make you believe EvE is all easy and it is raining ISKs and victory everywhere you go. Hello WoW …
Some people fall flat onto their face as soon as the tutorials end, because there is no one there to teach them further.
Short, you do get people who only take a peek at EvE and then leave again. You cannot make anyone stay who is not prepared to stay or brings the wrong expectations into it. You can only try to get them beyond the 14-day trail and make a month's profit of them before they quit again.
infact they don't come with anything except monopoly
Like I said, you are spinning shit … Do not read shit. Kick Jester out.
ok first of all if its a troll then 3/10, i care for what mitten says though i also happened to struggle with the bits that jester highlighted and wondered if its not a troll…
secondly i believe the point of upgrading the tutorial for noobs is to make sure that eve doesn't remain the niche (nerds/ex soldier's) game but one with larger more varied (more rl-like) population.
"Does Chess come with a tutorial? Does Checkers come with a tutorial? Does Monopoly come with a tutorial?" – no, i hope not and yes
my comment to the rest is:
you sir are a douche and/or a horrible shit of a troller
though i don't agree fully with all jester says here if you were familiar with some of his other articles/posts you… well you would still be a douche and equally wrong as you are now i bet
why don't you grow a pair and start blogging yourself, show us how its done.
the face-melting truth is that you are a bitter winning loser who can only judge others to make himself believe that doing fuck all is equally worthwhile.
———
good poast jester, keep up the good work, big fan
also, same to the poast below and sorry for typos
Thank you for your tears. It has been delicious reading your comment. You, like Jester, spin shit like my toilet does when it is flushed. You will keep spinning shit until the day you are able to accept my criticism without tears. Mark my words.
constructive criticism it is not, nor can i agree with any point you made, perhaps i can party agree with that mitten isn't as much of a big shot as he used to be but i think i understand most of the things he does and others like me will still care about what he says, you do have to read between the lines though and if he says something that doesn't make sense or isn't a very good lie you should wonder why he said it because i doubt its out of stupidity at this point in time
general status of eve you fucking moron
IDK I kind of expected (and I know Nulli expected) the SOCO to stand together on a couple of the station timers.
A shit article informing us that more shit from his junk drawer is on the way. Epic..
I love how Mittens spins this shit as superior tactics. Get a clue, it was superior numbers than let us stomp SoCo and Delve/Querious/Period Basis. Yeah, I'm not a fan, but lies are just that. LIES!
We generally didn't fight SoCo unless we had at the very least a 2 to 1 advantage, and most times it had to be 2.5/3 to 1 before we would go balls out. It just cracks me up that so many people believe everything they read, but those of us fighting SoCo know the real deal, know the truth. I'm not saying I'm proud of how we won, but we did win and our cute TEST bro's have a lot of new space!
Now they get to fight the real enemy, Blood Raiders!