Every now and then Corelin bring his heavy handed ramblings and points of views to Eve News24, we invite you to read more of his stories at his Mad Haberdashers blog.

Corelin’s Mad Haberdashers: Fall of the Republic

So SW:TOR has decided to go F2P. Ugh. If you want EvE stuff I promise there will be some later either today or tomorrow if I ever get happy with my BB38 entry, but this just has to be said.

SW:TOR is a perfect example of the kind of mismanagement that you can expect from people operating out of their specialty and without a good plan or the will to stick to it. I’m going to look at their key mistakes.

Listening to the PvP crowd

This is a rookie mistake. You hate to see it at the big-league level. I understand that PvPers are loud. We do that. We’re whiners. If rock paper scissors was a MMORPG the PvP forum would be rife with “PAPER IS OP, NERF PAPER SCISSORS IS BALANCED.” By embracing a WoW-esque instanced warzone model the devs assured themselves that every possible perception of imbalance would be held under a microscope in perpetuity. In itself this isn’t bad, but it can lead down a dark road.

Misapplication of resources

Oy. Three raids (sorry Operations) in beta, 2 at release, and those two buggy as hell. When did the third raid finally get released? Did they EVER fix the Soa bugs? Bioware poured more and more resources into “fixing” PvP while the “Story” (remember the 4th pillar of MMO gaming they touted so highly?) languished for MONTHS. There really wasn’t any new content, and what content there was came off as trivial. I leveled a tankasin pretty fast, found a good raiding guild, and main tanked both raids in one (short) night. The next day we did both hard modes, again with me main tanking. There was no particular challenge and any not terribly geared person could easily fill their role. That ended up being the state of the game until my unsub finally went through.

Treating forums as the end-all of player feedback

I don’t know how many surveys I filled out between the betas and the final unsub. My complaints stayed virtually the same the whole time. In particular I felt like I was always watching Luke, Ben & the bots walk from the cantina to docking bay 94 while leveling, even when I had a mount. Remember that part in the movies? Wasn’t it thrilling? The whole 20 minutes of them walking? Bugs in PvE hung around forever. Really painfully long. Look at the forums, a HUGE volume of posts in the PvP forums, and a lesser volume spread through the rest. It felt like Bioware was taking unsolicited feedback before solicited feedback.

No Urgency in Iteration

Again, how much new PvE content is there 6 months from release. 1 Raid. How much is on the horizon? Practically nothing. PvP has received a ton of iteration / new features and yet the subs keep tumbling. Why? Because there just aren’t enough pure PvP players to run a themepark MMO these days.

Now I want to talk about the model they seem to be going for.

This is doomed to be held up as an example of what NOT to do setting up an MMO for F2P. It really looks more like a demo against the full game. Which of course is what it is. If you want to see a great, nuanced, well designed F2P system look at Lord of the Rings Online. You can experience everything in the game without paying a dime, and you unlock more content either by paying cash for it, or playing the game more. This encourages people to play the game more, which means more players cooperating and creating more content for each other, something that EvE has turned into its core content creation method (see I worked EvE in.)

By going with two tiers, it creates a have and have not system, which is exactly what they will see. Haves are the people that plan on playing anyway, and Have-nots will only have a desire to drop money if there is something to push them beyond casual. There seems to be a cash-shop element as well, depending on what that has on offer it could give the have-nots a way to nuance their way in as paying players, but how well that is or isn’t set up is yet to be revealed.

 

- Corelin

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  • GFWP

    I can see where you are coming from, I do lots pvp in various games. One of the things I love about eve is the balancing CCP does. Sure there are some things that need adjusting, but the fact that they are constantly going over and re examining ships and mods is great. My only complaint really is that some ship's isk cost and sp requirements are to high or low when compared to other ships. Having a better balance for sub caps in this regard would just mean more options for pvp'rs with a budget. Which is always a good thing.

    • http://evenews24.com riverini

      I get your grip, we all bitch (and with due right) about CCP's hit and misses, but other games are fucked up beyond recognition compared to Eve Online.

      • The Raging Turtle

        Yeah at least CCP has a good routine of trying to fix their cock ups even though sometimes they do dig the hole too deep. (Though sometimes it does take time, it does get done)
        I once played SWTOR for a bit and a very short bit at that, because it felt like after the first day or so everything was repeating itself. PVP was dull and they didnt get off their arses to fix the problems or at least make it better. All they did was count the money not listen to the players problems and complaints or even use their brains.

      • NC. Scrub

        Fact.

  • http://poeticstanziel.blogspot.com/ Poetic Stanziel

    "If you want to see a great, nuanced, well designed F2P system look at Lord of the Rings Online."

    I quit LotRO because their F2P was horrible. It came to a point where there was no point actually being a premium member, once you hit max level, because there was no benefit at that point to actually paying.

    Secondly, Turbine started removing features that made the game convenient, and then turning around and making people pay to have those features back, including the premium members.

    F2P turned LotRO (which wasn't a very good game to begin with) into crap.

    • MWD

      That must be why Turbine started making money hand over fist after going F2P.

      • http://poeticstanziel.blogspot.com/ Poetic Stanziel

        Idiots play Farmville too. It's not a sign that they've produced a quality product.

    • Jakes

      I'm not sure if you were trying to say F2P platform is bad for PvP games, or that LotRO is just awful.

      If your saying F2P is bad for PvP games, then I disagree, and I only have to point to guildwar2 or LoL to prove my point. Lord of the rings was an awful game before it was free to play.

      • http://poeticstanziel.blogspot.com/ Poetic Stanziel

        LotRO's version of F2P is horrible. Arguing against Cor's assertion that it is an excellent example of F2P done right.

  • OnceABiowareFan

    There are plenty of PVPers to keep an MMO busy. SWTOR is just a shitty carboncopy of wow, no amount of balancing will change that fact. Look to Dayz. A million PVPers, in a game thats actually fun and challenging. 200.000 players daily playing an alphamod to a 3 year old game. Don't tell me there isn't enough pvpers in the world.

    You're right in that they've focused way too little on PVE. The reason for this is because balancing PVP and tweaking the numbers is a hell of a lot easier than creating new PVE content (artwork, sound, scripting, loadbalancing, testing etc etc). They gave up and cut their losses when they saw the figures, as any other greedy corporation would.

    I called it before they even begun making the game. This shits bust.

  • Scar

    The problems with games besides Eve is the fact that the companies that make the game make everything based around developer created content and this in and of itself will always be limited. Only so many developers work for any given company and they can only introduce new items every so often and during the time that they can't people hit max level, become bored and unsub or they introduce things too fast without doing enough bug testing shit is fucked and people unsub. The best formula is create content that allow players to compete and create their own content and allowing the developer deployed patches to be icing on the cake rather than the main course.

  • fa 123

    LOTRO sucks and TOR sucks, they are FB games with good graphics.

  • Test needs me

    He does bring up one good point…. Paper is totally overpowered.

  • Just Bob

    I was about to bitch about this not talking about eve at all…..
    then I understood and remembered :P P

  • buggrit

    They proved that making an excellent single-player game like mass effect does not scale to multiplayer.

    SWToR was designed as a single-player game w/ multiplayer layered over it in a big scale. Of course it had to go bust.

    Strong story is, by definition, a constraint that doesn't fit a sandbox player-vs-player thing. You can do it, but must do it WELL. Dynamic quest and objective generation, territory control, even assassination and infiltration missions generated against players or groups that are doing well. They could have done so much with it!

  • Rascal

    And down the drain goes EVEnews24.

    R.I.P

  • BladeRy

    Took a look at SWTOR for 2 days, unbalanced as fuck, some mobs are piss easy and 20f away are ones that will kill you 10 times in a row. Boring as hell since all quests are run around for 20 mins to location and kill something. Skills are boring also.
    As a matter of fact, i have honestly failed to see anything that would make me wanna play. I love SW as any oldschool nerd, but i just cant stand this crappy game. Eve made me fall in love in first few minutes, since 2005 when i first logged in.

    And after bioware killed Mass Effect I wish them the worst in any game they make, let them go to hell, and hope a meteor hits their office..or at least goddamn Casey Hudson.

    • BlameEA

      To be fair, Bioware has very little power on its own to do what they actually want with what time they need since they're now owned by EA, the company that is ruining almost literally everything they touch.

  • Calf Shit Detector

    I stopped reading at "… but it can lead down a dark road." Stop blogging calf shit, you virgins.

  • TAcker

    TL;DR
    everything is missbalanced everyone is crying but the worst people are those who cry about the criing ppl

  • anne o. nymous

    SWTOR should have fixed their server pop problems RIGHT AWAY, not 6 months after launch. I had a high level character trapped on a shitty low pop server, then had to reroll another on a high pop. The levelling grind was so goddamn slow.

    They should have iterated on Star Wars Galaxies (pre-CU/NGE), made a bad-ass sandbox with tons of story, interesting space combat, and open world PVP. Noone needs another wow clone because we can just play WoW, which is better run and managed. Eve is the only legit sandbox on the market and I think the gaming industry is ignoring the potential of the sandbox. Eve has its problems, but they know how to make a fucking sandbox work.

  • http://enl-i.com Still a reader…

    What is non-eve stuff doing on my eve website? -_-

  • nope

    Thought this was going to be about Amarr beating the crap out of Minnie lately. Misleading title is dissapointing. I hate you.

    • mf doom

      lolrp keep your mouth shut. you and Susan Black can play your dumb FW while the economy collapses, unsubs increase, and ccp is forced to drastic, a synonym for stupid, action.

      and goons win. they want the game to fall apart, their doing it in mechwarrior, they did it in second life. they live to hate you. if you enjoy you're game stop being so myopic.

  • Naaaaahhh

    It kinda makes you wonder; was EvE Online's creation of the PLEX actually revolutionary? Is DUST 514's micropayment system going to be the future of major games? Many curent developers are moving in or are discussing moving in payment directions that are highly controversial and highly unpopular (lockouts if you don't buy new online content every month, "renting" of the game, etc.). Is CCP actually brilliant?

    • Shogun

      PLEX system wasn't revolutionary, Ultima Online had been doing something similar for years before EVE was even out.

  • siratercomp

    NICE.