Sometimes the direction of game design conflicts with efforts to fight botting and illicit RMT within games. Take for instance the latest re-balancing of dedicated mining ships now underway in Eve Online. Eve’s game designers have many reasons for wanting to revamp this class of ships. First, CCP is currently undertaking a re-balancing of all ships in Eve so it makes sense that the roles of each mining ship are reviewed. The second is the desire to see New Eden’s low security space become more popular. The changes to faction warfare introduced in the Inferno expansion was part of that effort and making mining ships more viable in low-sec just expands upon that effort. The final reason is that Eve’s economy needs minerals for manufacturing and those who would mine in high security space don’t feel safe. Ships suitable for the hostile environment will make miners under CONCORD’s dubious protection feel safer.
While some cry out against the loss of easy ganking victims, others are rightfully worried about the effects the changes will have on the mining profession. Will the changes go too far and attract mass waves of botters back to strip bare the asteroid bots before those in North America can get home from school and work? That scenario has happened before in Eve and no one (except botters) wants to see a return of those days. By all accounts CCP Sreegs and Team Security’s War on Bots, especially since late February, has greatly impacted Eve’s botting community. Is another part of CCP about to undo Team Security’s good work?
To answer that question I spent yesterday on Singularity looking at the three Exhumer-class ships: Hulk, Skiff and Mackinaw. My industrial pilot has Exhumer trained to level 3 so was tagged with the horror honor of test flying the ships to check out the new changes. Be aware when looking at the statistics I’m about to present that she has two skills left to learn to receive her elite certificate in Core Competency so all of the skills are not at level 5. Also, she does not have any implants installed that would aid in these fittings.
Hulk
The Hulk, the ship currently with not only the best mining output but the best protection, is the ship all serious miners aspire to own. That I believe is about to change. Here is the new description for the Hulk.
“The exhumer is the second generation of mining vessels created by ORE. Exhumers, like their mining barge cousins, were each created to excel at a specific function, the Hulk’s being mining yield. The additional yield comes at a price, as the Hulk has weaker defenses and a smaller ore bay than the other exhumers.”
The big blow comes to the Hulk in the form of a 7,500 m3 ore hold that cannot be expanded. The area is not sufficient to hold the output of two full cycles (6 minutes) from 3 Modulated Strip Miner IIs. For those who currently shuttle back and forth between a station and asteroid belts this is a huge nerf to overall output, relegating the Hulk to use only when part of a fleet with Orca support.
The below fitting is a max yield set-up that demonstrates the thin tank on the ship.
 |
| A max yield Hulk. Note the lack of a tank. |
High
3 x Modulated Strip Miner IIMedium
2 x Limited Adaptive Invulnerability Field I
2 x Small Azeotropic Ward Salubrity ILow
2 x Mining Laser Upgrade IIRigs
1 x Medium Processor Overclocking Unit I
1 x Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Botting future: The changes will end the Hulk’s reign as the favorite mining ship for botters. The use by solo botters will end as those botters drift off to choices with a larger ore hold. The serious personal botters and those feeding illicit RMT operations will still utilize the Hulk as its superior mining yield makes the former tier 3 exhumer the superior choice in mining fleets supported by Orcas.
Skiff
The Skiff currently is a ship that specializes in the mining of the hazardous mineral Mercoxit. CCP has taken its rugged background into account and turned it into a tough, maneuverable little ship. With an ore bay capable of carrying 17,500 m3 the Skiff appears built for low-sec operations, especially short (20-minute) ninja outings. But with the max yield from its single Modulated Strip Miner II 17.8% less (at least with my skills) than the current max yield from a Hulk, using a Skiff would represent a loss of income for botters. For some reason mining botters do not like operating in low-sec.
 |
| A max yield Skiff is not squishy. |
High
1 x Modulated Strip Miner IIMedium
2 x Medium Azeotropic Ward Salubrity I
1 x Survey Scanner II
2 x Adaptive Invulnerability Field IILow
2 x Mining Laser Upgrade IIRigs
1 x Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
1 x Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
The above max yield fit shows how rugged the Skiff is. The reason for fitting a Survey Scanner II is that was about the only useful item that would fit after installing the two meta 3 medium shield extenders. Even with the presence that utility module the Skiff has a battleship-class tank.
Botting future: Compared to the current mining yield of Hulks, the consistent use of Skiffs would represent a loss of income for botters. The Skiff is suited to high risk environments and could see use by botters during events like Hulkageddon. If botters have to settle for using the Skiff then CCP will have won another round in the War on Bots.
Mackinaw
The Mackinaw is another specialty mining ship, one dedicated to mining ice. After the changes the Mackinaw will have a larger hold capacity, 31,250 m3, than any other mining ship. This, combined with the ability to fit three Mining Laser Upgrade IIs, give the ability to outperform the existing Hulk’s yield over long periods of time. While the Mackinaw’s Modulated Strip Miner IIs yield 10.4% less than the one’s on the Hulk, its ability to stay in a belt for 7 full cycles give bots the ability to make more ISK than with the old version of the Hulk. According to my rough calculations, the Mackinaw will pull in 1,500 – 3,000 m3 more ore per hour than the current Hulk that needs to return to the station each time its cargo hold fills up. Of course, if the Hulk has Orca support then the Hulk will outperform the Mackinaw.
 |
| A max-yield Mackinaw. Better than a Hulk. |
High
2 x Modulated Strip Miner IIMedium
2 x Limited Adaptive Invulnerability Field I
1 x Small Azeotropic Ward Salubrity I
1 x Small Shield Extender IILow
3 x Mining Laser Upgrade IIRigs
2 x Medium Processor Overclocking Unit I
Not only does the new-style Mackinaw pull in a slightly higher yield but as far as I can tell it also has a better tank than the current max yield Hulk. If the tank is not strong enough, pulling one of the MLUs for a Damage Control II will increase the tank by about 10,000 EHP but then the mining yield advantage disappears.
Botting future: While the Hulk will remain the choice of serious botters, including those involved in selling illicit RMT, the Mackinaw will become the favorite ship of the lone botter who relies on the botting software to shuttle the ship between the station and the asteroid belt. If Hulks prove too squishy after the changes, look for the Mackinaw to become the mainstay of all botting fleets.
Having looked at the changes in exhumers currently on Singularity I don’t think that CCP is giving the botters too much. The changes in the Mackinaw may give a non-fleeted botter an extra ore hold of ore over the course of a day. Those botters, by the way, don’t fuel the illicit RMT companies the way that botting fleets do. Looking at Hulks, I don’t see any change in mining yield and the slightly increased tank is not important.
In fact, I’m not that concerned about the increased tank on any of the ships. While ganking botters is useful and worthwhile, I have the feeling that once CCP fixes tech that Goonswarm’s bounty program for killing exhumers will end. Once that ends, I have the feeling the desire to gank miners, not just botters, will decrease dramatically. And if that is the case, then the amount of tank CCP gives miners won’t matter that much.
But just remember, trying to get the mining yield of the current Hulk will leave the mining ship vulnerable to a gank. While I may have created the fits displayed in this post on Singularity, I would never use them on Tranquility. I want a little more tank to discourage anyone who wants to claim I’m a bot.
- Nosy Gamer
"If botters have to settle for using the Skiff then CCP will have won another round in the War on Bots."
Botters getting a gank-free ship providing them with 80% of the yield of a hulk is "winning another round in the War on Bots"?
Good insight, retard.
Its not gank-free.
Just very expensive…
He did not say it would be a huge WIN.
Ganking was a thing before Hulkageddon was a thing, and it was also a thing way we started bankrolling it. If CCP fucks this up by pandering too much whiny miners then ganking, even as a hobby, will be finished.
Your forgetting that those "whiny miners" are now the backbone of the mineral economy, now that the drone regions no longer produce drone alloys and the ending of meta 0 rat loot.
I have to agree with this. I don't care who you are you have to see that long run this game needs to encourage human mining to get the economy in order. Giving mining options including some lower yield "safe" ships is fair.
While I understand gankings place in this game there is no reason why CCP needs to make ganking easy. HTFU Gankers
20% cut to mineral yield in exchange for being relatively immune to ganks. Sounds like balance to me!
/sarcasm
Relatively immune to ganks? Are you retarded? Have you been to highsec? If it's worth enough to someone ANYTHING is gankable.
Again for once it's time for gankers to HTFU. Oh PS I am a combat ONLY pilot I do not mine so I'm not saying this to further my love of carebearing. I am saying it because I believe mining needs to be made a more viable profession before a T1 battleship hull costs as much as a plex.
+1 to gankers HTFU
Hmm,
Ganker crybabies been through.
It is not that 60k EHP isnt gankable, its that its not in any shape or form cost effective. 60ehp is 6 tech 2 catalysts in a .5 system, 12 in a .7 system. it ~can~ be done, but catalysts will cost (at 15m each, and hell lets assume 7mil is returned by looting the mods) is minimally 48mil per kill in a .5 sys, and 100m in a .7 system. And of course, 60k ehp in tornados is about 6 tornados in .7 or higher.
Still worth it you argue? Not really, because of opportunity cost. First of all, there are not many miners anywhere lower than .7. Secondly by the time you are forced to organize 12 people for an /event/, It is far more worthwhile to go get 10 more people with tornados and go to niarja or Jita for freighters. The Skiff is functionally immune because a lot of ganks on mining ships currently are done by solo accounts, players with 2-3 accounts, or small groups of friends (2-4).
It is currently profitable to kill Hulks and mackinaws in .7 or lower, via salvaging the t2 hull for an average of 10m isk (often 0, sometimes as much as 50m), but that profitability is at a cost to sec status. It is a hassle to gank things as an outlaw, and the majority of ganks in higsec are not done by them.
Gankers will still ply their trade, but not after tanked skiffs.
I never mine in anything other than .5 if I can help it. You're almost never ganked, and the asteroids are better. This is in countrast to lowsec, where you will get reliably ganked every time, every day, all the time forever. *That* is what CCP is probably targetting, making lowsec less of a useless armpit. About time, too…
Like I said before I'm fine with this. I mean you have to think about this as if it were real life. Do you honestly believe that ship building companies wouldn't start selling customers tougher ships if the ones they made were easily gankable? This is exactly the type of changes that would apply in the real world. All the HP buffs come with a tradeoff and in a pinch a skiff is gankable…or you can always use wardecs.
I would have to say that I see a bigger argument for not allowing people to hide in rookie corps than I do for making ganking easier. Maybe rookie corps need higher taxes and CCP needs to figure out a way to tax mining. That way you can brick tank a skiff but you still have to learn to hide or defend against war decs.
Tankier mining ships are fine. Whats bothersome is the ship works at 80% of a hulk's efficiency… that needs to be lowered to 70 or 60 if you want to be (as I say) functionally immune to ganks in highsec.
No one has a problem with mining battleships.
While I imagine more balance might be necessary I think CCP has made a call on what they think is fair. If they find everyone in highsec only uses Skiff's then I would agree with you. But my guess is your going to start seeing all three exhumers which is a good thing.
I dont know why people think they will be 'relatively immune' sure barges are now much tougher but did burn jita teach these nubs nothing? A thrasher fleet alpha'ed a freighter. That should prove these ships will not be immune. The hunters will have to adapt their tactics most likely.
also i would welcome a tier 3 tech 1 bs costing as much as a plex. People are throwing around all kinds of ships around like they're chump change; what is wrong if they weren't?
Before was ok. Now? Fuck gankers. I want cheaper ships.
Fucking goons whine more than the goddamn miners do. Carebears! Pubbies <stupid made up goon word) they suck we hate them! Honest to god I don't understand why you sociopaths even care you're so fucking certain that your lives and experiences in 0.0 are so wonderful.
Goons created this mess by going overboard with ganking in the first place, no wonder why CCP reacted to miners calls for better protection. You guys got too greedy, you got too bullish, you went too far.
As you sow so shall you reap,
Wipe your eyes little goonie,
Its time to sleep.
Nothing is gank-free. Now, it will simply cost more than a 3 mil destroyer to pop a miner. Boohoo.
It costs a legit miner 300+ mil per gank. Gankers had to risk 1% of what miners do and they'll all fucking tears over CCP fixing this clear risk imbalance. What's that thing gankers tell everybody, harden the fuck up? lol, you guys are hilarious.
Cut the miners some slack before a BC costs more than 100 mil. Getting expensive to pvp as is. Let CCP sort out the botters they've been getting banned left and right.
People lose hulks in .7+ systems because they refuse to properly fit them. In case you didn't know, a properly fit hulk in a .8 system would require 2 tornados, or about 200m+ to kill. Orcas can store a hulk being attacked by a catalyst. There is already plenty of safety. Gankers tell miners to "learn to fit your ship" and "move to a safer system" aka "learn how to play the game you to which you subscribe".
Hulks will still die when idiots take them to .5 or .6; the problem is that idiots that take skiffs to the same place will most likely not receive a proper education. Isn't that a shame?
no its not, there should be a place for noobs in this game and lvl 1 and 2 missions are not anything but, even if they were give them a choice, i will support any motion for change that will result in less botters and more noob-friendlines, eve is meant to be tough as life is-granted,
but in life u can also just work hard as a builder or a cleaner and earn a okish living, mining should be a feature for noobs to do exactly that and for pro miners to organise mining fleets and corps in rorqs and orcas.
I myself always found pvp too expensive, particulary if you are average skilled and only have 10-20 mill skillpoints as a combat pilot, u have to grind rats or missions for ages (boooring) for every 'standard' ship of the line that you can u in fleets and have a bit of "fun"
seriously… people try hard to find this game fun but much more has to be done particularly for noobs to make it easier to enjoy this game
Grinding rats for ages when you have 10-20 mil sp?
Maybe this is a good idea, dont fly a drake to grind, save some isk for a mission boat.
A real mission boat i mean, something that can dish out around 800-1000 dps.
Maybe you will see then that grinding rats, doesnt have to tyake that long.
And yes i know, you will have to grind long to pay for that.
Well here is your solution, get another char, who can tank all rat aggro, with lets say a dominix, then get a talos char, wich can dps the crap out of the rats.
Oh well, you guys will probably just keepo ratting in drakes, cause some people just never learn.
i meant 'lvl2 missions are anything but' my point is that if you want more ppl in game u got to make it more fun, pvp is as fun as eve gets but its expensive… let noobs make more isk doing boring jobs like mining that no good player will do if he can help it.
and no, i rat in 0.0 in a well fitted navy geddon, doing annomalies, the gank risk aside…. its really taking many dull hours that make me want to scream before i can buy me a new pvp hull let alone insure it and fit it out…
plexes used to be good… now they are hardly worth doing if u ask me… incursions-yes ok, if you have a fleet, if not, well, might as well do the 40 jumps back to your 0.0 ratting system coz finding a decent fleet and make good isk is almost imposible unless u pick a time when there aren't many people online…
unless u buy plexes or have loads of friends or are super smart it imposible to enjoy this game really… perhaps thats what ccp is trying to achieve anyway…
well i have a carrier now and know how to rat in it and not get caught by alliance buddies (as its frown upon) and now i'm quite happy, i make enough isk per hour on annomalies with the carrier to enjoy the game, But for years when i had no skills and no carrier it was pure agony, i still can't plex up all 3 accounts from the isk i make without compromising on PVP funding that makes the game fun for me
U sir, need to change your alliance and get introduced to what we call reimbursement program.
That is easier said than done. TEST just raised its taxes and is about to implode, others get their assets stolen or even get their space devalued by CCP.
The only advantage of a reimbursement program these days seems to be that when shit hits the fan will you not be alone with it. You will be sitting together with your friends in the same shitty alliance.
bring in the Tier3 BC and your enemies will crumble beneth your guns.
Cost/Reward for ganking miners in highsec have gone up yes.
the mining ships have been revamped to somthing better
we got 3 clear path with both T1 and T2 ships
the only thing that bothers me is the yeld diference between a Covetor for 40m and a Hulk for 300m but im hoping CCP will look in to it.
Guys, I think I found one of the few players in EVE who has a thought process that goes beyond 'herpderp all miner ar botter an go BOOM hurrhurr'
+1 for you Sir.
Silly noob..
Nerfing tech won't stop hulkageddon
Hulkageddon is funded by the same people building your hulk so they can farm more money from you.
No, but nobody using hulks because they suck would. …Unless you want to rename it "Mackinawgeddon," and bring something beefier than a fucking catalyst to the table for once. Mining is only profitable if you *don't* lose a 300million ship every week, so you can bet every single miner will pick better tank over a 10% mining increase every time. If we want 10% that bad, we'll get an implant or something.
If the hulk is gonna suck this bad, they'd better make them a lot fricking cheaper to build, or I'm staying with incursions. Ideally, I'd like to do exactly what I was doing: get max yield, hit a button every *9* minutes while I read a book, jet can and pick up 4-5 at a go with an industrial. If you think that's me "being lazy," I offer you the following challenge: make mining less goddamn boring and I'll think about it.
*That's* the core of the problem, here; Eve mining is painfully, agonizingly dull, and it doesn't have to be. Instead of fucking around with cosmetic ship changes, CCP ought to make mining a game rather than a chore, and it'd be a lot more popular. Tie yield to a minigame, something like PI. Have an asteroid have "hotspots" and it rotates or shifts, and you have to keep the lasers on track – this would almost completely eliminate bots in one blow. Make asteroids last more than 15 minutes before they pop and then magically reappear the following morning; that system was always idiotic anyway. Much more accurate to have them last all day, and then the following morning it's empty, and you have to chase down the new hot system… (kind of like incursions.) Jesus, anything but more minor ship rebalancing that never works…
Crafting and resource gathering in MMOGs are invariably terrible add-ons, and then they wonder why nobody likes them.
So you waht all the miners chasing down the "hot systems", im not gonna say thats stupid, but thats a really dumb idea and the minigame? that might hit botters but its also a smack to the face of ppl like me who uses more than 1 miner.
I use 6-8 accounts while mining and so does alot of other ppl and a minigame like that is gonna make it impossible to keep doing so and thats all because you want fun.. GTFO and let the mining be done by the ppl who actually like it..
Hey fuckface – the op has a valid point, and you have terrible spelling.
Mining is the most boring activity in a video game. I challenge you to come up with something more boring. Ice mining is even worse – you literally sit there for 8 minutes and hit ONE BUTTON (assuming you don't have to GTFO).
If you like mining, it's because you're either a) someone who's got way too much fucking spare time on their hands (I'm looking at you, most likely unemployed member of a socialist country who pays you to sit on your ass), or b) you're a masochist.
Wow the stupidity in you amazes me.
Also, i can see you are a grammar nazi.
Also I agree with that a minigame would be stupid.
Mining as it is, is cool for some people who have other stuff to do, but want to engage in eve anyway.
I for one, have to look after my kid and see if she doesnt destroys the house
Meanwhile i will have my miner and orca running so i can click every now ad then.
This is ideal if i cant really focus on eve, but can make some isk anyway.
I think there are a lot of people who do this also.
Anyway if you want mining to be less dull, go farm missions in a hulk.
There should be some asteroids in there also and well i guearantee it will keep you busy.
The thing about mining in Eve is that it's not meant to be a solo activity done on one account.
if you're one guy with one account mining then of course you're going to be bored. if you want to play solo then go PVE or PVP camp some gate. Trade, haul, manufacture, research those are all solo activities you can do on one account. Solo mining will not be profitable and boring as hell. Agree with that.
Mining is a multi alt profession. Whether it was designed that way is another matter, but it is today. You will find very few serious miners in eve with just 1 account. Unless that miner is supported by a corp fleet in which case you enjoy the crack with your corpies while waiting for stuff to happen.
I started off with one account mining. Bored as hell if I did it on my own but pretty good fun when a corp op was called. So I started an alt to haul which I trained for an orca. Then i got another miner then another then another. when you have 4 or more miners running + an orca alt then mining is no longer boring. Agree that ice mining a solo account you hit 1 button every 8 minutes. Yawn fest. But with 5 accounts you're hitting buttons every other second, shifting junk from hold to orca, shifting that junk from corp hangar to ore bay, warp to POS back again……
when you multi box mining is no longer boring but a pretty intensive activity. Oh and the heart stopping moment waiting for the fleet to warp out when the red pops into your null sec system…
Solo mining = boring as hell. Go do something else or get with a fleet.
Multibox mining = a click, alt tab fest to drive you insane
I think perhaps you're focusing so much on bots that you forget there are people, like real people, who mine ice or ore, who absolutely love these changes. I run a fleet of 8 hulks/macks w/ 2 orcas by myself, I am not a bot, and the changes I've seen so far make my life a hell of a lot easier.
The chances of a gank in highsec currently are so small that it's hardly an issue for any serious miner who pays attention. Before this change I might lose 1-2 exhumers per 30-40 billion in profits, I don't honestly know who these people are who cry about getting suicide ganked. As a miner I loved hulkageddon and other such events, it meant massive profits and a bit more excitement.
Adding the extra hp buffer matters not much in highsec, in lowsec and null or wh space the buffer is nice but its not going to make much difference, if you're caught you're dead.
The changes to the cargohold on the mack makes it the ideal choice for people like myself running many accounts without botting. If I really want to chase efficiency and turn it into a clickfest I can switch to hulks.
I hope that CCP continues to heavily ban botters and chase new methods of security against them, or just says fuck it anyone can bot. The waffling about in the middle is what allows illicit rmt to thrive. If anyone can legally bot/macro, the economy would restabilize around it and those who did not take advantage and bot for income would only have themselves to blame. This has happened before in other games like Ultima Online which was one of two games which inspired the creation of Eve (the other game was freelancer obviously).
In UO it was originally prohibited to bot/macro, but because some aspects of the game were so dull that everyone macro'd them anyway, OSI finally just said fuck it macroing/botting is legal now, do what you want, the economy adapted to it.
I'm not saying that I agree with botting, I don't. What I'm saying is, either go all in and try to kill the accounts of eve single botter in eve with every means available to you. Or, allow it and be done with it. Both methods have been proven to work in the past.
I am guessing you (correctly) mine in .7 or higher. Most of the whine comes from miners in the .5 and .6 systems.
as for botting, if it were ever made legal the price of ships would plummet. I prefer that the ships people fly are worth something, and that when lost it means something.
Thats because genuinely smart miners dont hang out in 0.5 or 0.6…they mine in -0.7 or -0.8 in the middle of a giant blue dot on the map, in a grav site, with intel channels that cover the entire region.
I'd say you're pretty much a botter at 10 accounts. Maybe you're an organic bot, but you're still a bot…
At least he is at the computer. My idea of a bot is somebody who sets the program up in the morning, heads to work, then comes home to billions of isk.
Congratulations! You are jealous of his 10 accounts. You win a posting bot.
I must agree; Building game mechanics for the sake of addressing botting ruins the game. As a side comment it also means that CCP is FAILING at dealing with the core issue. (Code injection into EvE message packets).
In principle it is also wrong to manage the majority in an effort to control a small minority. But that is what authoritarians seem to do well.
making ships worse than they used to and calling it "rebalancing" is another ccp epic failure and the sign of corporate erosion. one more quarter is finished with meaningless updates. phuck you, players, very much.
By what delusional metric does this make the mining barges worse? Huge 100+ percent increases in EHP, huge 100+ percent increases in ore holding capacity, and less skill prereqs for the t1 barges. Literally nothing changed for the negative.
lower ore output on a miner, could be considered worse.
you seem to be well into the EHP, but the miner has an actual function too.
I dunno though
What boost are they giving Hulks again??? Oh yeah, Literally nothing changed…
I have said a Zillion times that what this game needs is a Capital Mining Ship with Capital Mining Lasers. Use the Orca design and make a T-2 variant with jump drive for Null sec (ala Rorquel).
I love ganking mining ships hulks and mackinaws, the tears you get are always so funny. I have always been astounded however that I can spend 10m on a T2 fit catalyst and blow up 200m worth of ship, salvage the wreck with a noobie ship and collect those intact armor plates and make a profit.
I think to gank a 200m ship you need to spend considerably more then 10m, these changes are exactly what are needed, hulks and macks are still gankable but you will have to spend more time and money investing in a ship capable of doing it in time.
… Mean while in null sec somewhere…
Miner1:
"hey, did you hear, CCP have added ore holds?
Miner2: Oh yeah, why is that?
Miner1: Hell if i know (ejects jet can)
The articles on mining barges get worse with every day. This one has got to be worst!
In fact I sense a botter's tears. A botter who knows these changes will fuck up his bots, again, like so many changes before. Now he fights back on EN24 by pretending these changes will make his bots stronger that it will bot out the sun!
But do not mind me. Do keep telling yourself that these changes will be of an advantage to botters. Who really gives a shit about the players' advantage when your bots are at risk of dying out? *lol*
Frankly, I see more botter tears coming, because no matter how you change the ships will it not stop CCP from detecting your bots. Face it, dear botter, you are getting fucked by CCP Sreegs, the mining barges are getting better and you find yourself left behind with nothing but a bleeding arse.
sorry, one pore point, though its not fair that botters should make millions while poor carebears have it tough… fucking up botters means higher mineral prices, thats good for honest miners but not so good for honest pvpers
Fucking up botters is actually good for PvPers. True, less bots will lead to less flooding and price dumping, but it also means that the worst of all players – the botters – disappear from the game.
The prices have been going up for all of us, not only for the PvPers. And if you are a good PvP then you will cause more damage than before (when measured in ISKs) and the loot you pick up from wrecks is more worth, too. So you do not really lose, unless you are bad at PvP, but you have a good chance of making more profit than before.
Also being bad at PvP is often the reason why some use bots. They are too dumb to get it right and fail to cover their constant losses. They cannot win so they break the rules. It is hardly ever the good guys who cheat.
can you tell who is botting and who is afking? i know for sure i will be afking in my mackinaw when this chnage comes but i know for sure if i afk a lot of people will report me as a bot lol. If you susept someone as abot just report them.
At least you're not like that guy earlier in the week who was still putting cargo expanders on it in an effort to get 'just one more unit' or crystal…
P.S. Exhumers 5 brings the mack up to 37.5k of cargo, and the retriever up to 30k. i can sort of foresee large scale ice-rigged retriever fleets at the ice belts in highsec, will do wonders for the price of an iced tea….
Any word on the ORE 'Digger' frigate yet?