EVE University graduate. Drama Llama. Covert operations pilot. Poetic Stanziel has been very active in the blogging community bringing views from seasoned high-sec pilots, we please to share his stories and views on current Eve Online events and invite you to read more stories from his Poetic Discourse blog.

Poetic Discourse: AT X – Zero Point Teams Out of the Group Stage? Maybe Not

It seems CCP doesn’t quite know how to put together a Rules section for the Alliance Tournament. They’re scattering the rules across the tournament website pages. A tad hard to figure out what the rules are if they aren’t all in one place.

Hail Mary setups, for extra points, are possible. The rule explaining this is not on the Rules page, but rather in the Format section of the tournament website. Nutty.

Intentional Handicaps
If a team begins the match with less points value worth of ships than their opponent, and wins the match, they score extra ranking points equal to the difference in the two teams’ values.

(It is the Format page that also details the 25% win bonus.)

So, is a zero point team really out of the tournament? Perhaps not. It really depends on whether CCP is allowing any meta-gaming. But I’ll touch on that after constructing a possible week two match that could send a zero point team into the group stage.

Test Alliance and No Holes Barred both have zero points. They are fighting each other on Saturday. Let’s say Test really really wants to get to the group stage. How? Well, Test builds a 10 point team. No Holes Barred builds a 50 point team. If Test Alliance wins, they earn 50 + 40 = 90 points, plus their 25% win bonus for a total of 112.5 points. Which should be more than enough to get into the group stage.

But, how does a 10 point team win against a 50 point team? With ISK. Test Alliance offers No Holes Barred some large sum, let’s say 50B ISK, to put together 50 points of terrible fits, basically to throw the match. Let the 10 points worth of Test ships blow up all 50 points of No Holes ships.

This year, CCP banned alliances from fielding more than one team, the B and C team rule. Which is fine, in my books, since it allows more alliances to participate, who might not have been able to otherwise. According to their rules page, CCP may in fact be banning all obvious meta-gaming is obvious during the tournament, disallowing all thrown matches of the super-obvious variety. The following rule can be found on the Rules page:

Penalties
For Alliance Tournament X the referees can call a match null and void or declare a result if they believe that one of the teams is not competing. This tournament is designed to showcase the talents of pilots and should be entertaining.

Potentially banning meta-gaming? Paying other alliances to throw matches is a time-honoured tradition of the Alliance tournament.

As it stands, if No Holes and Test Alliance go head-to-head, 50 point setup versus 50 point setup, neither team stands any chance, whatsoever, of getting into the group stage. Meta-gaming plays an important role here. One team gets to advance (most likely) and the other gets some phat ISK for the alliance war chest.

My interest level in the first day of competition during week two has dropped significantly. The majority of those matches mean nothing. At least with meta-gaming, the spectator is left to wonder whether any backroom funny business has gone on before each match.

Bit of a shame really, if scenarios, like the one I outlined above, are not allowed to happen. That’s taking CCP’s paranoia, over the Hydra/Outbreak final from last year, a bit too far.

- Poetic Stanziel

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  • YOOO

    yea ban test

    • YOOO

      No fair play in this retard at and ccp suck ass
      What the point in participate in an competition if it not fair play??

      • Anhenka

        you hear that sound? That's the sound of someone whose fourth language is english crying themself to sleep, horrified by everything related to what you just posted.

        • Small debate

          You've learned three languages before English? That's retarded.

          "Meh, I'm prolly not gonna need that English in my life that much… let me learn Swahili first."

          • Polyglot

            "Fourth language" doesn't mean he learned it after he knew 3 other languages.
            It means he knows 3 other languages in addition to English.
            English is my 4th language too and i learned it second, see what i did there?
            (If i said that English is my second language you'd have lost the fact that i know 2 other languages)

          • bob

            and no one still would have cared

      • Scar

        <Sarcasm>Yep it isn't fair when shit teams get knocked out in the first round. I personally think they should go all the way to the finals.</Sarcasm>

  • Random Miner

    still don't understand why anyone cares who wins these. With every new post it's just made clearer and clearer that it's an isk game, not a talent game, as usual

    • Iamchucknorris

      yea when is eve about skills. Maybe your character skills and some common sense but that's about it. Need no skills to fly anything really.

      • http://twitter.com/xxxAlloxxx @xxxAlloxxx

        Trolling right? If not I will chalk you up to a null f1 monkey.

  • Devore

    This is getting ridiculous. Just turn the tournament into a bidding session already; he who brings the most ISK to the table gets named the champion, and we can get the whole sordid mess over with and move on.

    Clearly, CCP wants the tournament to be a show of piloting skill. There will be inevitable metagaming. Everyone expects spies and intel for counter-comps. But outright throwing a match for ISK? What does that show? That your alliance carebears too much? There's no competitive spirit in this.

    Neither TEST nor No Holes Barred deserve to move past the qualifying rounds, having managed to earn a grand total of zero kills. Buying their way past a team that actually worked together to tackle and DPS someone down is not something CCP wants to see. And I don't know how many spectators want to either.

    • Silentskills

      you for referee sir

    • Duck eh

      Then atleast make it 3 matches so teams have the chance to win even if they get destroyed once
      This encourages people to come back with even better setups without having to gimp them. And in the end more competative matches.

  • bla

    I had a lot of fun watching the alliance tournament last year.

    And then there was the final which destroyed all my fun. I think they got what they wanted, give the audience a big middle finger and such. But this year I'm not interested and watching anymore.

    I understand fully that CCP wants to get rid of such jokes of pilots because it actually hurts the tourney. Without viewers it's worthless and CCP got to do what they do to keep those viewers happy.

  • CCPFailORama

    Fact is the qualifying rounds are fucked anyway. CCP has set up a pseudo Swiss match setup without setting it up properly. If you get shut out in or und one, there's little reason to showing up for round two because you have no chance to advance. The seedlings and ranking system is fucked because the rules for how the ranking works seem to be completely at random with no basis in rules that you can read anywhere. And this year, previous winners got the shaft and didn't get an automatic group round bid. Clearly, CCP has little idea as to how to run an actual tournament.

    • Scar

      You clearly have it all figured out. Where is your alternative tournament that we can all watch because yours will be the best and greatest tournament of all time with a perfect ranking system and everything. Link me to your live stream O'mighty perfect armchair tourney organizer.

      • whatever

        esports community has a lot of experience with different tournament formats – and CCP ignores all lessons learned over the past 10 years.

  • OP is a Dumb ass

    You must be completely stupid to actually believe letting people buy wins in the only major eve tournament that only happens once a year is a good idea. This is an event for everyone to enjoy, the competitors get to try and prove they are among the best, the spectators get a grand show and get to see a lot of interesting fleet concepts.

    I realize there will always be some funny business, but saying "fuck it" we'll just let our tournament be completely meaningless and devoid of any real competition is bad, and you should feel bad for suggesting it. I'm guessing you have never been involved in any RL sports, or even gaming competitions. I want to see the best pilots in eve fight to the death, I want one alliance to be the last team standing and hold the title of best small gang pvp'rs until next year. If the idiocy you suggested was allowed, I wouldn't even bother watching a single match.

    The first few days have been shit, but most of the shit teams are being wiped out, and in just one or two more rounds we will be left with a few solid teams. The matches will get much better as more and more get eliminated. Suggesting that two shit teams who got skull fucked because they are bad, should be allowed to throw matches so they can continue to produce shit matches deep in the tournament is utterly moronic. If you want better matches, let the weak die off.

  • Qwerty4812

    right… cause CCP will totally not question 10 points killing 50 points